Gather 'round for 'pinion time boys and girls.
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Gather 'round for 'pinion time boys and girls.
APS Liquid (water) and APS Mercury are both powers that turn you completely into a liquid of one form of another. APS Mercury states specifically that the character must still breathe and is vulnerable to gas attacks, while under APS Liquid (again presumed water) it says nothing in either form regarding this. Most GMs, I have seen, ruling over this power just automatically go with APS Liquid doesn't need to breathe.
Do you think this was an oversight on APS Liquid or some added disadvantage to APS Mercury?
Do you think this was an oversight on APS Liquid or some added disadvantage to APS Mercury?
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Re: Gather 'round for 'pinion time boys and girls.
An added disadvantage to APS Mercury.
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Re: Gather 'round for 'pinion time boys and girls.
Glistam wrote:An added disadvantage to APS Mercury.
Same.
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Re: Gather 'round for 'pinion time boys and girls.
What reductions to APS Mercury would you think would allow for no breathing?
"Understanding is a three-edged sword."
Kosh from Babylon 5
"You don't understand, so you find excuses."
Doctor Who
"Peace has made you weak. Victory has defeated you."
Bane
Kosh from Babylon 5
"You don't understand, so you find excuses."
Doctor Who
"Peace has made you weak. Victory has defeated you."
Bane
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Re: Gather 'round for 'pinion time boys and girls.
SittingBull wrote:What reductions to APS Mercury would you think would allow for no breathing?
I wouldn't. Not at lower levels at least.
Maybe at somewhere above level 7 would I let the char "learn" how to make gills out the "tentacle' sub-power. But with the gills only working in water. And such a "Learning" would be a GM fiat sort of mod.
Last edited by drewkitty ~..~ on Sat Nov 07, 2015 10:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Each question should be give the canon answer 1st, then you can proclaim your house rules.
Reading and writing (literacy) is how people on BBS interact.
Each question should be give the canon answer 1st, then you can proclaim your house rules.
Reading and writing (literacy) is how people on BBS interact.
Re: Gather 'round for 'pinion time boys and girls.
I ignore both. If your body is made of water, "liquid", mercury, ice, metal, whatever as long as it's a single homogeneous material, you no longer have a metabolism that chemically reacts something with oxygen to survive. As such, breathing is no longer required.
I don't care about canon answers. I'm interested in good, well-reasoned answers and, perhaps, a short discussion of how that answer is supported or contradicted by canon.
If I don't provide a book and page number, then don't assume that I'm describing canon. I'll tell you if I'm describing canon.
If I don't provide a book and page number, then don't assume that I'm describing canon. I'll tell you if I'm describing canon.
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Re: Gather 'round for 'pinion time boys and girls.
SittingBull wrote:What reductions to APS Mercury would you think would allow for no breathing?
You typically get more than one power selection, I would say if that's something the player wants then they need to also acquire a power which provides that benefit rather than trying to shoehorn it into an existing power.
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Temporal Wizard O.C.C. update 0.8 | Rifts random encounters
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kiralon: "...the best way to kill an old one is to crash a moon into it."
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Grim Gulf, the Nightlands version of Century Station
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Re: Gather 'round for 'pinion time boys and girls.
flatline wrote:I ignore both. If your body is made of water, "liquid", mercury, ice, metal, whatever as long as it's a single homogeneous material, you no longer have a metabolism that chemically reacts something with oxygen to survive. As such, breathing is no longer required.
For the sake of simplicity i do this too
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Re: Gather 'round for 'pinion time boys and girls.
SittingBull wrote:APS Liquid (water) and APS Mercury are both powers that turn you completely into a liquid of one form of another. APS Mercury states specifically that the character must still breathe and is vulnerable to gas attacks, while under APS Liquid (again presumed water) it says nothing in either form regarding this. Most GMs, I have seen, ruling over this power just automatically go with APS Liquid doesn't need to breathe.
Do you think this was an oversight on APS Liquid or some added disadvantage to APS Mercury?
Neither. APS Liquid characters do breathe, except when merged with water.
HU2, p. 246 (emphasis added):
3. Water Merge: The character can completely merge into water and cannot be seen. In the water form, the character does not breathe in the conventional sense (the water is oxygenated);
This means that the character does require oxygen, and therefore would be vulnerable to suffocation and gas attacks (including pollution or deoxygenation of a body of water that the character is merged with).
There you go man, keep as cool as you can.
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Re: Gather 'round for 'pinion time boys and girls.
Tinker Dragoon wrote:SittingBull wrote:APS Liquid (water) and APS Mercury are both powers that turn you completely into a liquid of one form of another. APS Mercury states specifically that the character must still breathe and is vulnerable to gas attacks, while under APS Liquid (again presumed water) it says nothing in either form regarding this. Most GMs, I have seen, ruling over this power just automatically go with APS Liquid doesn't need to breathe.
Do you think this was an oversight on APS Liquid or some added disadvantage to APS Mercury?
Neither. APS Liquid characters do breathe, except when merged with water.
HU2, p. 246 (emphasis added):3. Water Merge: The character can completely merge into water and cannot be seen. In the water form, the character does not breathe in the conventional sense (the water is oxygenated);
This means that the character does require oxygen, and therefore would be vulnerable to suffocation and gas attacks (including pollution or deoxygenation of a body of water that the character is merged with).
Bingo.
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Re: Gather 'round for 'pinion time boys and girls.
The Artist Formerly wrote:Tinker Dragoon wrote:SittingBull wrote:APS Liquid (water) and APS Mercury are both powers that turn you completely into a liquid of one form of another. APS Mercury states specifically that the character must still breathe and is vulnerable to gas attacks, while under APS Liquid (again presumed water) it says nothing in either form regarding this. Most GMs, I have seen, ruling over this power just automatically go with APS Liquid doesn't need to breathe.
Do you think this was an oversight on APS Liquid or some added disadvantage to APS Mercury?
Neither. APS Liquid characters do breathe, except when merged with water.
HU2, p. 246 (emphasis added):3. Water Merge: The character can completely merge into water and cannot be seen. In the water form, the character does not breathe in the conventional sense (the water is oxygenated);
This means that the character does require oxygen, and therefore would be vulnerable to suffocation and gas attacks (including pollution or deoxygenation of a body of water that the character is merged with).
Bingo.
So tell me, if the character is made of 100% mercury, what does he need the oxygen *for*?
I don't care about canon answers. I'm interested in good, well-reasoned answers and, perhaps, a short discussion of how that answer is supported or contradicted by canon.
If I don't provide a book and page number, then don't assume that I'm describing canon. I'll tell you if I'm describing canon.
If I don't provide a book and page number, then don't assume that I'm describing canon. I'll tell you if I'm describing canon.
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Re: Gather 'round for 'pinion time boys and girls.
flatline wrote:The Artist Formerly wrote:Tinker Dragoon wrote:SittingBull wrote:APS Liquid (water) and APS Mercury are both powers that turn you completely into a liquid of one form of another. APS Mercury states specifically that the character must still breathe and is vulnerable to gas attacks, while under APS Liquid (again presumed water) it says nothing in either form regarding this. Most GMs, I have seen, ruling over this power just automatically go with APS Liquid doesn't need to breathe.
Do you think this was an oversight on APS Liquid or some added disadvantage to APS Mercury?
Neither. APS Liquid characters do breathe, except when merged with water.
HU2, p. 246 (emphasis added):3. Water Merge: The character can completely merge into water and cannot be seen. In the water form, the character does not breathe in the conventional sense (the water is oxygenated);
This means that the character does require oxygen, and therefore would be vulnerable to suffocation and gas attacks (including pollution or deoxygenation of a body of water that the character is merged with).
Bingo.
So tell me, if the character is made of 100% mercury, what does he need the oxygen *for*?
I don't know, I'm not an expert in mercurial biology.
Zerebus: "I like MDC. MDC is a hundred times better than SDC."
kiralon: "...the best way to kill an old one is to crash a moon into it."
Temporal Wizard O.C.C. update 0.8 | Rifts random encounters
New Fire magic | New Temporal magic
Grim Gulf, the Nightlands version of Century Station
Let Chaos Magic flow in your campaigns.
kiralon: "...the best way to kill an old one is to crash a moon into it."
Temporal Wizard O.C.C. update 0.8 | Rifts random encounters
New Fire magic | New Temporal magic
Grim Gulf, the Nightlands version of Century Station
Let Chaos Magic flow in your campaigns.
- Tinker Dragoon
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Re: Gather 'round for 'pinion time boys and girls.
flatline wrote:So tell me, if the character is made of 100% mercury, what does he need the oxygen *for*?
To live, apparently.
There you go man, keep as cool as you can.
Face piles of trials with smiles. It riles
them to believe that you perceive the web they weave
and keep on thinking free.
-- The Moody Blues, In the Beginning
Face piles of trials with smiles. It riles
them to believe that you perceive the web they weave
and keep on thinking free.
-- The Moody Blues, In the Beginning
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Re: Gather 'round for 'pinion time boys and girls.
flatline wrote:The Artist Formerly wrote:Tinker Dragoon wrote:SittingBull wrote:APS Liquid (water) and APS Mercury are both powers that turn you completely into a liquid of one form of another. APS Mercury states specifically that the character must still breathe and is vulnerable to gas attacks, while under APS Liquid (again presumed water) it says nothing in either form regarding this. Most GMs, I have seen, ruling over this power just automatically go with APS Liquid doesn't need to breathe.
Do you think this was an oversight on APS Liquid or some added disadvantage to APS Mercury?
Neither. APS Liquid characters do breathe, except when merged with water.
HU2, p. 246 (emphasis added):3. Water Merge: The character can completely merge into water and cannot be seen. In the water form, the character does not breathe in the conventional sense (the water is oxygenated);
This means that the character does require oxygen, and therefore would be vulnerable to suffocation and gas attacks (including pollution or deoxygenation of a body of water that the character is merged with).
Bingo.
So tell me, if the character is made of 100% mercury, what does he need the oxygen *for*?
My Opinion on the matter would be that when the character transforms (be it APS power or other in general) they are essentially making one body "tangible" and the other one (or multiples if they have multiple transformation powers) "intangible" like the Major Power. In this way the character still has to breathe since intangible characters still have to breathe. Now some situations might allow the character to "breathe" via the tangible body (like APS: Liquid's Water Merge). This might not work for all situations (like size manipulation) that transform characters, but it would seem to explain why APS characters still need to breathe.
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Re: Gather 'round for 'pinion time boys and girls.
flatline wrote:The Artist Formerly wrote:Tinker Dragoon wrote:SittingBull wrote:APS Liquid (water) and APS Mercury are both powers that turn you completely into a liquid of one form of another. APS Mercury states specifically that the character must still breathe and is vulnerable to gas attacks, while under APS Liquid (again presumed water) it says nothing in either form regarding this. Most GMs, I have seen, ruling over this power just automatically go with APS Liquid doesn't need to breathe.
Do you think this was an oversight on APS Liquid or some added disadvantage to APS Mercury?
Neither. APS Liquid characters do breathe, except when merged with water.
HU2, p. 246 (emphasis added):3. Water Merge: The character can completely merge into water and cannot be seen. In the water form, the character does not breathe in the conventional sense (the water is oxygenated);
This means that the character does require oxygen, and therefore would be vulnerable to suffocation and gas attacks (including pollution or deoxygenation of a body of water that the character is merged with).
Bingo.
So tell me, if the character is made of 100% mercury, what does he need the oxygen *for*?
Can't be made out of 100% mercury (like substance, according to the power, not actually mercury). Otherwise the character couldn't think or act or shape itself. 100% mercury like substances wouldn't have any brain cells. There must be something more going own.
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Re: Gather 'round for 'pinion time boys and girls.
Regarding APS: Liquid
Actually, it does mention breathing. Page 284, "Water Merge", In water form, the character does NOT need to breathe in the conventional sense (the water is oxygenated); thus he can stay in or under water for an indefinite period of time.
Regarding gases: Page 285, under #5 "Limited Invulnerability" - Just before it mentions electricity, it says Also, gases do no damage
Mercury does NOT have oxygen as part of its make-up, so you have nothing to breathe "from yourself".
Actually, it does mention breathing. Page 284, "Water Merge", In water form, the character does NOT need to breathe in the conventional sense (the water is oxygenated); thus he can stay in or under water for an indefinite period of time.
Regarding gases: Page 285, under #5 "Limited Invulnerability" - Just before it mentions electricity, it says Also, gases do no damage
Mercury does NOT have oxygen as part of its make-up, so you have nothing to breathe "from yourself".
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Re: Gather 'round for 'pinion time boys and girls.
NMI wrote:Regarding APS: Liquid
Actually, it does mention breathing. Page 284, "Water Merge", In water form, the character does NOT need to breathe in the conventional sense (the water is oxygenated); thus he can stay in or under water for an indefinite period of time.
Regarding gases: Page 285, under #5 "Limited Invulnerability" - Just before it mentions electricity, it says Also, gases do no damage
Mercury does NOT have oxygen as part of its make-up, so you have nothing to breathe "from yourself".
This.