How much does illustration accuracy matter to you?

[Pepsi Jedi]

The Railgun in question uses a drum. That would be the rather boxy looking thing infront of the grip. It looks boxy but what you're seeing is the 'drum' from the side. In profile. The thing connecting to the bottom of the grip, would likely be the connector to the Skelebot. Powering the rail gun itself.

As per the OP though, Good art catches the eye. It makes you want to use the _____ in question. Be it a pistol, a rifle, a bot or a vehicle. I brought this up in other threads. NG 1 has some AMAZING Art in there. I mean.. Chuck... wow.... Just wow.. and he's not the only one. There's other good art in there. I think the Mannings did some of the hand held weapons. Beautiful.......

That being said, NG's stuff has stretched over 33+ world books. Some of those drawings were collected and dropped into NG1. And.. some of them were drawn by drunken monkeys... or someone's kids. One or the other. Some have bent barrels, as if they were wilting. Some have just horrible art. And... some of the new art looks like it was drawn on paper napkins at Pizza hut while on lunch. THOSE bother me. When I see a cannon with a droopy bent barrel. It bothers me. When I see art work that was clearly sketched out and never cleaned up. It bothers me. When I see a gun with vents on the side or something, and they're irregular, sloppy, slanted at different angles or wider or skinner (Yes you find this in NG1 too) It bothers me.

So, yes. Crappy Art bothers me.

Does every bot have to look 100% the same? no. Some are customized. Some are changed a bit after they take damage, etc. That happens. Thus a CS abolisher made in Iron Heart might look a bit different from one made in Lone Star.

That's not an excuse for lazy or crappy art though. Get a ruler if you're drawing something made of metal.

[BuzzardB]

I don't usually tend to pay TOO much attention to that kind of stuff, but I do go back and look at robots when all of their weapons and stuff are listed. I'm not sure how it works at PB, whether its write-ups based on art or art based on write-ups, but they USUALLY seem pretty accurate and I really appreciate it.

It bothers me when their ISN'T a picture of something, because I buy the books for the art as much as the crunch and fluff.

The bent guns that bother Pepsi so much really rub me the wrong way too...especially since it's in several books.

[Pepsi Jedi]

The Railgun in question uses a drum. That would be the rather boxy looking thing infront of the grip. It looks boxy but what you're seeing is the 'drum' from the side. In profile. The thing connecting to the bottom of the grip, would likely be the connector to the Skelebot. Powering the rail gun itself.

I'm going to have to disagree with that interpretation. The 'drum' that you speak of is hardly big enough to contain all the rounds listed in the description: The light drum will hold 600 rounds and can fire 30 bursts.

We don't know how big rail gun 'rounds' are. It's the kinetic impact of the thing that imparts the damage. Bullets themselves, the actual round are small. It's the propellent and casing that takes up most of the size. As for the drum, part of the problem is that they're designed for robots and power armor. so it looks like a SMG, that you could almost one hand and shoot, but that's based on robotic or PA strength.

The gun itself is 45lbs. The drum adds another 30. That's 75lbs for the railgun. With the lightest drum. The heavy drum, adds 100lbs, topping it out at almost 150lbs.
To give comparison, the Barrett M82, weighs 30lbs with a 29inch barrel, and an over all length of 57 inches. That's a four foot, nine inch rifle, that shoots a .50 cal bullet that weighs half again less than the rail gun in question.
http://media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/ ... e517b1.jpg

So the C-200 is a BIG gun. That is to say, it weighs half again MORE than a gun that's almost 5 feet long and is barely man portable.
Thus the drum in question is likely a foot 'long' from front to back and likely big around. Like these sorts of drums that can feed into an AR15. Could even have one round 'drum' on each side. http://cdn2.armslist.com/sites/armslist ... 6__640.jpg

So the gun and or drum is plenty big when you conceptualize how 'big' the gun is itself.

And: Reloading a drum will take about three minutes for those not trained, but a mere 30 seconds for a field-capable mechanic.

The 'drum' shown in the illustration apparently feeds into a standard ammo port. So why would there be a special requirement to be able to load it? Looks like a standard 'plug and play' type ammo feed.

The 'workings' of Super advanced Super-science/tech, are alien to us. It'd be like asking a cave man how a tv works. he can see that it does. See things on the TV, but he'd have no hope of understanding how it works. Tech, at the level of super science is the same sort of thing. Now "Hey it's a gun man" yeah.. I know.. but it's a rail gun. *shrugs* A RIFTS rail gun. Rifts.... has... what we can, if we're being charitable, say is a nodding association with real technology. That becomes even less of a nod when you talk about military things.

Why does it take 30 seconds to reload? Who knows? You might have to actually bolt the thing in, the recoil of the gun, the weight of the ammo (30lbs!??) etc. You might literally have to bolt the thing into the gun, and or unbolt and bolt a new one in to change out the drum.

We simply don't know "why". What we know, is "that's what Kevin said". Which, if you're being honest, was very likely just plucked out of the air and sounded good at the time.

My interpretation, based on text and illustration, is that the drum is located on the back of the Skelebot.

I don't think so. usually when you see Railguns in Rifts, they are not belt fed. They're big rifles. I think the 'cable' you're stting there and in the skelebot illustration is just the connecting cable linking it to the skelebot's power supply.

As per the OP though, Good art catches the eye. It makes you want to use the _____ in question. Be it a pistol, a rifle, a bot or a vehicle. I brought this up in other threads. NG 1 has some AMAZING Art in there. I mean.. Chuck... wow.... Just wow.. and he's not the only one. There's other good art in there. I think the Mannings did some of the hand held weapons. Beautiful.......

Well....mostly. For example, the NG-UV1 Solar Powered Mini-Laser (NG1, p197)

For the record, the ones on page 197, were the ones I was saying looked like they were sketched on a napkin in pizza hut.

says it can take a e-clip, but nowhere on the illustrated weapon is there a e-clip port.

Don't see a port in vibroblades either. Still, they use them. I've always assumed they had ones that slid up into the handle. Almost like a battery pack. i'd assume the same one fit in that butt ugly tube sketch.

In another example, the NG-SE17 Laser Carbine (NG1,p196) says it can only take one e-clip, when the illustration clearly shows two e-clip ports.

No. I've addressed this before, actually. You see what appears to be two eclips but it doesn't mean both are in 'ports'. Some rifles have the ability to carry extra magazines/shells/bullets in their stocks. That's a bullpup designed rifle (And still one of the crappy drawn ones) but the 'rear' clip you're seeing is likely just there in a holder. You deplete your first clip (The one near to the hand grip and trigger) you eject your spent clip, pull the second one from it's handy little holder in the butt of the rifle and slap it into the port. Rock and roll.

While not 'common' this isn't totally alien to guns we have now.

Good points, all.

Thank you.

[The Galactus Kid]

Well, first and foremost, a good rule of thumb is that in Palladium books art is not canon. The printed word ALWAYS supersedes the art. It's not a huge problem, and Palladium artists do an awesome job of trying to be true to the text and the reference material.

[Pepsi Jedi]

Well, first and foremost, a good rule of thumb is that in Palladium books art is not canon. The printed word ALWAYS supersedes the text. It's not a huge problem, and Palladium artists do an awesome job of trying to be true to the text and the reference material.

I think you had a little typo in there. I'm pretty sure you meant "The printed word ALWAYS supersedes the art" not the text.. which would be the printed word. lol.

That said, I've seen this kicked around before. "Palladium books art is not canon". I see it come up pretty much any time this topic is talked about.

My question is. Where did you see/read/hear that? Who said that Palladium Book Art is not canon? This isn't me being snarky, it's an honest question, as it's a pretty massive statement. I've not, to my knowledge, seen such a statement published and I'm curious as to why people think it.

[mumah]

Well, first and foremost, a good rule of thumb is that in Palladium books art is not canon. The printed word ALWAYS supersedes the text. It's not a huge problem, and Palladium artists do an awesome job of trying to be true to the text and the reference material.

This is just a statement that illustrates how writers think their words are sooooooo important and the art is just pretty wallpaper.

[Pepsi Jedi]

Well, Mike, I've seen people say it before. GK isn't the first I've seen say such, so I honestly am curious as to where/how that got started. Did Kevin come out and say it at some point in print? Not a "oh I talked to him while he was peeing at a convention one time" but was it ever actually said where we can look it up and verify it? It seems like a rather massive sweeping statement.

Or is it just "internet legend" that's been repeated, and people pick it up and a year down the line think they read it officially, and then they say it so some other guy has seen it two or three times, so he accepts that it's true, and it's really just passed down the way.

I'm not saying GK is lieing. I'm asking where that statement came from. I have seen it multiple times but never a cited source.

[The Galactus Kid]

Well, first and foremost, a good rule of thumb is that in Palladium books art is not canon. The printed word ALWAYS supersedes the text. It's not a huge problem, and Palladium artists do an awesome job of trying to be true to the text and the reference material.

I think you had a little typo in there. I'm pretty sure you meant "The printed word ALWAYS supersedes the art" not the text.. which would be the printed word. lol.

Yes, thank you Pepsi. Fixed.

That said, I've seen this kicked around before. "Palladium books art is not canon". I see it come up pretty much any time this topic is talked about.

My question is. Where did you see/read/hear that? Who said that Palladium Book Art is not canon? This isn't me being snarky, it's an honest question, as it's a pretty massive statement. I've not, to my knowledge, seen such a statement published and I'm curious as to why people think it.

Kevin. He's stated it multiple times at conventions and open houses.

This is just a statement that illustrates how writers think their words are sooooooo important and the art is just pretty wallpaper.

Well, our words ARE important. Compare sales of game books to sales of art books. Boom. Now, I will say that the art stable that we have is top notch and our artists are some of the most awesome people in the industry. Except Mumah. That guy sucks.

[mumah]

Hee hee. Usually errors come on some details either the didn't see that particular item listed in the job spec or they didn't have that detail when they began that job, and we have to decipher the writers unedited gobbledeegook that might have been written in crayon. Usually we get our assignment very early in the editing process, sometimes something will get changed after the fact. Very often the writing gets edited to match the artwork, since that's easier to change. If there's a mismatch between the text and the art, then the disparity wasn't noticed. With everything that goes into each book, that's perfectly understandable.

[Jorel]

I think there is as much art based text as text based art and until recently with Chuck and NG they haven't spent a lot of time fixing inconsistencies in anything.

[Eashamahel]

It does actually bother me when the pictures don't match up to the description as far as vehichles, robots and such go, but it's been like that since the first RIFTS book, so I don't think it's something that's going to change. It's unfortunate, but again is something that comes back to editing, proof reading, ect which has never (seemed to have) been a big PB priority.

Most of the time I've seen the descriptions used over the art. Sometimes the art has been such a mess that the description is what you have to go by because otherwise you'd have no idea what is going on. Other times, the rare and funny ones, people find that they've just assumed something to have been a certain way (possibly for years) because that's how it looks.

The really bothersome ones are where not only does the art not match the writing, but where the descriptions doesn't match the stats which don't match the writing. Those are the ones that just boggle me.

[Jorel]

I think the past few years and the internet have seen them having writers and artists revising their work to fit the bigger picture.

[Hotrod]

If the illustration in question is a map, then I care very much. Otherwise, accuracy matters, but the rule of cool dominates.

[Premier]

As one of the Freelance Artist on the current roster, I think and hope what we are seeing is a transition into a more consistent visual representation that accurately matches the canon lore.

Personally, I see validity in what everyone is saying.
Historically there have been some visual inconsistencies (minor or major) where some Artists have taken more liberty with a design or their interpretation of another Artist's illustration than others.

Ex: the NG Samson X-9. From the first illustration depicting it to the Ramon Perez version to Scott Johnson's Dinosaur Swamp cover, there are minor differences between each illustration, but the overall consistency that make this PA easily recognizable for what it is in all three illustrations. With NG2, I took it upon myself to unify these variations into one solid, satisfactory and hopefully canon representation of the NG-X9 Samson PA. When I talked with KS about the NG-X9 variations via art printed earlier, there was nothing said from him regarding art not being canon, but it was certainly more of a joint effort to preserve the most common visual factors in each depiction, as if they were canon references.

I was also inspired by a PB thread where someone inquired about the NG-X9's 202 Railgun which wasn't depicted within any of the previous illustrations. I drew my own version immediately ( thinking "Lets Rock...!!!!") to fit the bill. However, I learned that the Mannings had already illustrated one for NG1. Instead of just leaving my finished railgun onto the X9, I erased it and enjoyed rendering the Manning's NG-202 illustration. It provided some creative thinking implementations to the PA.

1. Where was this heavy weapon going to be mounted when not in use?
2. Was I going to add some side mounted rack that was never depicted before and add to the visual inconsistencies?.
3. How did the Samson access the 202 when needed?
4. It still had to be connected to the ammo drum mounted on the back,so how could this all manage without getting in the way during handling?

These questions and though provoking challenges provided innovation possibilities. I came up with a few ideas and after discussing the matter with an already overwhelmed KS, we devised a method that worked very well. The Rifle would lock into place along the back, atop of the shoulders, just behind the neck. Hydraulics built into the backpack housing would unlock and lift the NG 202 up about one foot from the rest of the backpack unit. The Samson could then easily reach up and grab this weapon from over head and bring it in-front of him for easy use. No need to disconnect and reconnect the ammo feed or anything. Easy accessibility and stowing away and very much the way the military soldiers would stow a heavy rifle of today, across the back.

Not only did it fix the challenges, it stimulated some cool rpg visuals of visualizing several Samsons deploying from a dropship or bounding into action from above and these hydraulics lifting these large rail-guns up and them reaching back and grabbing them down ready for action as they landed.

I was able illustrate the mounted rifle from the rear view in the illustration. So while I focused on unifying the X9 for a more canon appeal, I also was able to contribute a part of a revolutionary step for this RIFTS classic.

That is how I see the Palladium art; as "visual representations & references" for what is written. The more current roster and objectives within the Freelance Artist roster the more consistent and as close to canon as I think you'll see in Palladium Books (to date that is).

Ex: NG1 visual debut of the NG 202 railgun depicted by the Mannings. I used that illustration line for line, shape for shape for every NG 202 railgun that was assigned to other NG PAs as if it were canon.

I view PB art now as if it were canon or aim for visual depictions that I can contribute to help hone the art towards a strong canon reference, very much the same way one would expect any other IP to be consistent. This is not to say that every Artist will have an exact duplicate as there are variances caused by aesthetic choice, Artist interpretation of previous depictions, Artist skillsets, etc. However the end result should be pretty consistent so that a novice can identify the same design even if illustrated by different Artists. With the current roster of Artists, I think developing canon visuals is going to be far close than the previous art, (I Hope).

We Artists, appreciate your support and will continue to strive to produce the best that we can as both quality Writing and quality art go hand in hand in the success of Palladium Books products.

-- Chuck

[The Galactus Kid]

Everything chuck just said

Thank you for that insight, Chuck. It is always great to know that these steps are taken This is what makes Palladium's artists the very best in the biz.

[Jorel]

yup. Thanks for backing up what I had just said 4 posts above that.

[Pepsi Jedi]

That said, I've seen this kicked around before. "Palladium books art is not canon". I see it come up pretty much any time this topic is talked about.

My question is. Where did you see/read/hear that? Who said that Palladium Book Art is not canon? This isn't me being snarky, it's an honest question, as it's a pretty massive statement. I've not, to my knowledge, seen such a statement published and I'm curious as to why people think it.

Kevin. He's stated it multiple times at conventions and open houses.

So... with out meaning to come off bad or anything... It's never actually been officially said. We've just got hearsay versions of something that would be a major sweeping statement that would affect 100s of books and 1000s of items?

Again I'm not calling you a liar GK, but, this sounds very much like something that was said by one guy, taken as chip truth and then passed on down the line as if it were a solid fact. I'm not saying you started it GK. I -have- heard it alot, but have never read it in print as an official rule, and other than, well your answer above, never seen where it's come from. "Oh Kevin's said it at conventions all the time" .... *Wince* Well. He didn't say it to me... and while some things are said at conventions, unless you were there, you don't "KNOW" that they were said.

I am not comfortable throwing out 1000s of illustrations as 'non cannon' based on "Oh someone told me they heard him say it at a convention" with no details or anything other than "Oh yeah I heard that too" as conformation of having happened. I mean if someone said "Well one time Kevin told me at an open house, that all the CS command sit around watching My Little Pony videos from before the coming of rifts then dress up in animal costumes and do naughty things" You'd laugh at them and roll your eyes. "Sure he did buddy".

It's hard to tell the difference between pony play, and Kevin having supposedly said that 1000s of pics in his books are non canon. He may have said it. Or it may just be something a guy claimed, that others heard, thought true and passed it on as truth till lots of people think it's true but don't really have a basis to point to.

If it was "If the written description differs from the art, use the written description first." yeah.. that sounds more reasonable. But 'Palladium art, is not canon', is just a big thing for books that rely on the visual medium along with the player's imaginations to thrive.

[Jorel]

I feel like I heard Kevin mention it more than once on the few I listened to for the call in podcast Prince Artemis does/did. Whatever it's called. I think I've actually heard Kevin say it there.

[Eashamahel]

I was also inspired by a PB thread where someone inquired about the NG-X9's 202 Railgun which wasn't depicted within any of the previous illustrations.

-- Chuck

Just because I'm curious, was that thread done recently or was it an old one? I started one not too long ago about that exact same topic: viewtopic.php?f=8&t=141996&hilit=samson+railgun

[Premier]

Everything chuck just said

Thank you for that insight, Chuck. It is always great to know that these steps are taken This is what makes Palladium's artists the very best in the biz.

Thanks for the kind and encouraging words GK!
Us Artist enjoy a good read that stimulates creative illustrations and production. Such steps I know I have experienced with KS, Alex, Wayne and Jeff Burke. Only with a few other companies that I have worked with, know how to opportunistically take advantage of a studio production team mindset. Others operate more like a robotic assembly line, but miss out on the creative discussions and fine tuning of a creative team. There are still things I would personally like to see happen with us Freelancers as far as PB art goes, but I think we are getting off to a solid start, I hope.

[Premier]

I was also inspired by a PB thread where someone inquired about the NG-X9's 202 Railgun which wasn't depicted within any of the previous illustrations.

-- Chuck

Just because I'm curious, was that thread done recently or was it an old one? I started one not too long ago about that exact same topic: viewtopic.php?f=8&t=141996&hilit=samson+railgun

Eashamahel, Your the one!!! It was your exact inquiry thread that was the inspiration for me making the X9's super 202 more definitive in the illustration. Allen and Brian Manning had illustrated the NG-202 in NG1 that I referenced as canon, and I went from there. I was really pumped afterwards as the visuals and handling of everything just came together so well. I now see the NG-X9 Samsons as powerful juggernauts that are awesome PAs for a PA pilot to start off with. They have the accessibility, the reliability, the kingdom diplomatic neutrality, speed, the MDC, the array of weapons and also the gaming room for Players to still be humble and seek growth. You can actually afford to make mistakes in this power armor without killing your character or deafening your team mates. The Samson has earned a new fondness in my heart.

Furthermore, they can be very formidable if you are forced to contend against them, thus earning their respect on both sides of the fence.

So, as you can see and attest, you never know what constructive critic or curious inquiry may be answered or how any of your posts may be influential to any of the games that has brought us all here.

Thanks for inquiring

[Premier]

yup. Thanks for backing up what I had just said 4 posts above that.

Actually I thank You Jorel. Thanks for the support with PB and the Freelancers that contribute. Also I appreciate those who see that PB is not perfect but it is trying to grow in a positive direction, some growth may be faster in some area versus others, but quality and more product are the goals and objectives that I think the Writers and Artist are all seeking to deliver.

[Jerell]

I wonder, how exactly do rounds feed into a chamber on a Rifts rail gun? Like is there a bolt or something? Is it all powerful electro magnets? I feel like I need to understand that before I begin to formulate a decent idea of how it would or would not take long.

Maybe you have to check and calibrate head spacing like a .50, though I don't know why you would have to on a rail gun. <shrug>

[Pepsi Jedi]

We don't know how big rail gun 'rounds' are.

With all due respect, PJ (because I do respect you and think you are a good guy), that strikes me as a very weak extrapolation. If the front drum, as you contend, is the ammo feed then why would it require special expertise to reload it? That doesn't make any sense. Why would the CS design a ammo feed that couldn't be instantly reloaded in the field? -- They don't do that on any other hand-held weapon.

My point was addressing how many rounds could fit in the drum. As per how long it takes to reload, it comes back to we don't know the mechanics of the actual machine and how they interact. the Recoil from Railguns are said to be extremly heavy. You might actually have to bolt the thing on to get it to be set and function right. We don't 'know'. We only know what we're told by the creator.

It's the kinetic impact of the thing that imparts the damage. Bullets themselves, the actual round are small. It's the propellent and casing that takes up most of the size. As for the drum, part of the problem is that they're designed for robots and power armor. so it looks like a SMG, that you could almost one hand and shoot, but that's based on robotic or PA strength.

I honestly don't see the relevence in your above paragraph....

Comes back around to "It might look like a sub machine gun in the drawing, but we know from the weight of the thing, that it's pretty big. I.E. Bigger than it looks alone there. So the drum is bigger than it looks, and thus could hold more rail gun ammo. (As rail guns don't use the explosive force of gun powder to propell the round, they don't need the shell casing and primer and gun powder, so you can get more 'rounds' in the same amount of space.)

The 'workings' of Super advanced Super-science/tech, are alien to us. It'd be like asking a cave man how a tv works. he can see that it does. See things on the TV, but he'd have no hope of understanding how it works. Tech, at the level of super science is the same sort of thing. Now "Hey it's a gun man" yeah.. I know.. but it's a rail gun. *shrugs* A RIFTS rail gun. Rifts.... has... what we can, if we're being charitable, say is a nodding association with real technology. That becomes even less of a nod when you talk about military things.

With respect, I don't buy that.

Really? Look at the boom gun/glitterboy. Nodding association with real technology that becomes even less so when you talk about military things.

It doesn't make sense that a drum-fed rail run would require special training to reload it if it was mounted on a standard ejection-port style gun.

It's not a 'standard ejection port gun'. 1) It's a rail gun and 2) Why would you need an ejection port on a gun with no shell casings to eject? Rail guns work by using magnets to accelerate the metal projectile at high speeds. There's no shell with gun powder in it. So no hammer is hitting the shell to ignight the gun powder, produce the explosion that propells the bullet down and out of the barrel. Then no shell to eject.

As for why would it require special training to reload? We don't know. It's hyper tech. It's created by gaming guys that have shown over decades that the majority of their military knowledge comes from movies, and design is more on TactiCOOL than Tactical, and again is only has a nodding association with real tech/weapons. As I pointed out. It's a beast of a gun, the recoil from a weapon that size, yanking around a drum that weighs 30lbs on it's own might be significant to the point where you bolt it in. Or it may take special tools. Why? To help keep it proprietary. I.E. to make it very hard for someone not trained to use.

We don't know. We're only speculating. It has nothing to do with the actual weapon itself. Drum fed is different from "Belt fed".

Why does it take 30 seconds to reload? Who knows? You might have to actually bolt the thing in, the recoil of the gun, the weight of the ammo (30lbs!??) etc. You might literally have to bolt the thing into the gun, and or unbolt and bolt a new one in to change out the drum.

Still not buying it. I think WB simply F'ed up in illustrating the weapon.

that's also possible, but the simplest explanation is likely the correct one. We have something on the gun that appears to be a drum. So i'm going to think that that thing that LOOKS like a drum, is a drum, and that thing that looks like a power link up, is a power link up. If nothing else, it keeps the drum a drum and the power link up, NOT a belt where rail gun bullets are going through.

[Jerell]

I'm not just any fool.




Sorry, I couldn't resist.

[Premier]

It doesn't make sense that a drum-fed rail run would require special training to reload it if it was mounted on a standard ejection-port style gun.

It's not a 'standard ejection port gun'. 1) It's a rail gun and 2) Why would you need an ejection port on a gun with no shell casings to eject? Rail guns work by using magnets to accelerate the metal projectile at high speeds. There's no shell with gun powder in it. So no hammer is hitting the shell to ignight the gun powder, produce the explosion that propells the bullet down and out of the barrel. Then no shell to eject.

As for why would it require special training to reload? We don't know. It's hyper tech. It's created by gaming guys that have shown over decades that the majority of their military knowledge comes from movies, and design is more on TactiCOOL than Tactical, and again is only has a nodding association with real tech/weapons. As I pointed out. It's a beast of a gun, the recoil from a weapon that size, yanking around a drum that weighs 30lbs on it's own might be significant to the point where you bolt it in. Or it may take special tools. Why? To help keep it proprietary. I.E. to make it very hard for someone not trained to use.

We don't know. We're only speculating. It has nothing to do with the actual weapon itself. Drum fed is different from "Belt fed".

I view such armament as this: It requires training because of the various ammo types that can be utilized and each type may require different reloading and handling. An ejection port may not be used while using rail gun rounds, while other types of rounds that are propelled by hammer discharge that may be also fired by such armament by converting the dischargers and sealing off the rail accelerators for such ammo might require more specific training.

I also would take into account the amount of rounds fired at such a high velocity through the electromagnetic accelerator shaft would potentially generate some excessive EM flux that might need to be purged from the shaft via such an ejection flux bleed port. This is what I visualized for why the rail guns discharge in segmented bursts. A continuous chain feed discharge simply produces higher rates of unstable EM flux, should someone depressingthe trigger opt ot ceasea high rat eof fire, the residual excess of em flux coudl eb a liability. Thus having a Flux bleed port might suffice.

Awe.. heck I digress.. but that's what I would say if I were GMing,

[Jorel]

I'm not just any fool.



Sorry, I couldn't resist.

I'd offer you a domestic partnership but Jorel says he'll kick my ass if I flirt with you.

Why you gotta bring me into this? Seams risky.

[BuzzardB]

Thanks for the kind and encouraging words GK!
Us Artist enjoy a good read that stimulates creative illustrations and production. Such steps I know I have experienced with KS, Alex, Wayne and Jeff Burke. Only with a few other companies that I have worked with, know how to opportunistically take advantage of a studio production team mindset. Others operate more like a robotic assembly line, but miss out on the creative discussions and fine tuning of a creative team. There are still things I would personally like to see happen with us Freelancers as far as PB art goes, but I think we are getting off to a solid start, I hope.

I'm soooooooooooo excited to get NG1 and 2...almost exclusively for the art...

[mumah]

In NG1, Chuck's illustration of the Hovertrain (pg94-95) clearly shows a forward laser cannon on the left side of the train. But if anybody bothers to look there is also the tip of the barrel of a smiliar laser cannon on the right side. Nevertheless, the description tells us that there is only one forward laser cannon.

Any fool can tell you that it doesn't make sense for NG to only put a cannon on one side of the train. Nevertheless......

There's a simple explanation for inconsistencies you might see between the test, which details a vehicle's starting package. We generally draw them that are in use enough to be customized.

[zyanitevp]

There's a simple explanation for inconsistencies you might see between the text, which details a vehicle's starting package. We generally draw them that are in use enough to be customized.

Could you elaborate (please)?

Maybe it's just me, but I couldn't put your response with the observation I made.

Thanks in advance.

Not to speak for Mumah (after all, he is a Red Wings fan), the bottom line is they get instructions early, and oftentimes the design changes in print, not the art. Not the artist's fault.

[The Galactus Kid]

In NG1, Chuck's illustration of the Hovertrain (pg94-95) clearly shows a forward laser cannon on the left side of the train. But if anybody bothers to look there is also the tip of the barrel of a smiliar laser cannon on the right side. Nevertheless, the description tells us that there is only one forward laser cannon.

Any fool can tell you that it doesn't make sense for NG to only put a cannon on one side of the train. Nevertheless......

There's a simple explanation for inconsistencies you might see between the test, which details a vehicle's starting package. We generally draw them that are in use enough to be customized.

This is a really good explanataion and one that I can get behind 100%. As I've stated a couple times here, Palladium artists are awesome and I love everything they do. Chuck's previous comment about his artistic process and Mumah's thought process here just show how much really goes into their artwork.

[Sureshot]

Myself it matter quite a lot.

In the books we see mages and psychics in the heat of battle. Yet at the same time mages according to the fluff in the books are supposed to be sneaky and hidden. Robots and power armor are supposed to be powerful and have more than one weapon. Yet when one reads the stats and information do less damage than the ones with one weapon.

[Grell]

In other words, do the technical details of an illustration matter to you?

For example, the Deadman's Railgun (which first appeared in Coaltion War Campaign, p96) by Wayne Breaux has an impossible ammo feed.

It's not really a big deal and I certainly do appreciate all the incredibly hard work that Palladium's various artists have put into their work. I appreciate creativity over technical aspects any day.

However, in many games, when there was a debate over how something could be done, I've noticed that many players will point to an illustration and give arguments based on it.

Just curious to hear people's opinions.

I will verbally describe something if I want to relay specific technical details, but I use artwork (book or otherwise) to give an impression or point of reference for what I'm describing. I've had one too many instances where a player has based an entire combat strategy based off the illustration and then became enraged when it didn't work.

So no, illustration accuracy isn't that important but that isn't to say it shouldn't be recognizable for what it is.

[kaid]

After having a chance to read NG2 now fully there is some really amazing artwork in it the new samson picture is great. Still basic shape of a samson we have seen before but this time it actually sports the rail gun and a pretty mean looking one too and it is also standing next to a person not in armor so you can see the relative size. One thing I notice is chuck seems to work foot troopers in with a lot of his armor/vehicle pictures which is great because its a lot easier to get a feel of the mass of something for players and GM's when you can put it next to something your brain "gets". You see something standing next to a person you know that persons height could vary but you still get a solid feel for how big something is.

For things like the extra gun mount on the hover train I just wrote that off as they had added one of the turret upgrades. No reason the engine of a hover train could not mount the same or similar modular turret mounts the other cars can.

Overall the art over the years for palladium has been excellent. Some artists are more stylized and some are more technical about accuracy but for the most part most art in rifts while maybe not strictly "cannon" has been typically accurate enough for use by GM's and players.

There are some hiccups now and then like having one fewer mini missile launch tubes than stated in the text but overall the art that is made to depict and armor or weapon in the description of that armor or weapon in general is pretty accurate. Given the wide range of time involved and artists involved there are some ups and downs but overall from kevin longs art back in the day up to the current batch of artists they do an excellent job.

[Razzinold]

I would like it if the art is considered to be accurate with the text as written. Also like other people have mentioned art that is low quality, or no art provided at all, can diminish the overall quality of the book.

I know that art has caused problems in the past for some players, mostly with vehicles/PA, not just with weapons but even simple things like "where the heck is the door" or "how to I get inside this Robot/PA".

Do people always make the robots sit down first, is there an elevator hidden in the leg, an outside elevator (like NASA) that leads to an opening ? I ask because I am not really familiar with their use, because I don't use them, but I don't ever recall reading in the write up on how to get in, just how many people it can hold/takes to operate it.
If I am wrong, someone please point it out to me so I can read it.

I know there are a couple of examples for getting into PA, I always just assume that either the chest or back open up and you climb inside.

[kaid]

I would like it if the art is considered to be accurate with the text as written. Also like other people have mentioned art that is low quality, or no art provided at all, can diminish the overall quality of the book.

I know that art has caused problems in the past for some players, mostly with vehicles/PA, not just with weapons but even simple things like "where the heck is the door" or "how to I get inside this Robot/PA".

Do people always make the robots sit down first, is there an elevator hidden in the leg, an outside elevator (like NASA) that leads to an opening ? I ask because I am not really familiar with their use, because I don't use them, but I don't ever recall reading in the write up on how to get in, just how many people it can hold/takes to operate it.
If I am wrong, someone please point it out to me so I can read it.

I know there are a couple of examples for getting into PA, I always just assume that either the chest or back open up and you climb inside.

This is one reason I like chucks art so much is for bigger robots and vehicles it is usually pretty obvious how you would go about entering them. Most of the examples of PA we have seen "unbuttoned involve the chest plate opening up and them basically climbing in that way given power armor is powered body armor most would work like this. Some odd ones like the samson/delila which are way bigger than man sized now show a bit more clearly the pilots positioning in them and describe the driving position better which helps understand how they get in and drive it.

[Josh Hilden]

Side Tangent.

When I was still Freelance RPG writing I loved writing to the art. One of my favorite things I wrote for Palladium was in Rifter 44 The Nyak Star Spider... I got that awesome image from Mumah and ran with it!

[The Galactus Kid]

I agree Josh. I wrote the Gulgoth in that issue based on the Bradshaw art. I now own that piece and have it prominantly displayed in my game room.

[Pepsi Jedi]

I will say again. I noticed previously that Chuck likes to put foot troops in pics with bigger vehicles. I love that. So yes, you do get a sense of scale. I haven't gotten NG2 yet but others have commented on it, and I love that he does that.

[BuzzardB]

I will say again. I noticed previously that Chuck likes to put foot troops in pics with bigger vehicles. I love that. So yes, you do get a sense of scale. I haven't gotten NG2 yet but others have commented on it, and I love that he does that.

I concur, I think its awesome.

[mumah]

In other words, do the technical details of an illustration matter to you?

For example, the Deadman's Railgun (which first appeared in Coaltion War Campaign, p96) by Wayne Breaux has an impossible ammo feed.

It's not really a big deal and I certainly do appreciate all the incredibly hard work that Palladium's various artists have put into their work. I appreciate creativity over technical aspects any day.

However, in many games, when there was a debate over how something could be done, I've noticed that many players will point to an illustration and give arguments based on it.

Just curious to hear people's opinions.

Hear that, Brandon? ART TRUMPS WRITING. Bam.

[Premier]

Myself it matter quite a lot.

In the books we see mages and psychics in the heat of battle. Yet at the same time mages according to the fluff in the books are supposed to be sneaky and hidden. Robots and power armor are supposed to be powerful and have more than one weapon. Yet when one reads the stats and information do less damage than the ones with one weapon.

Sureshot, I couldn't agree with you more on this subject matter. Often if we receive an assignment, each illoe describes the contents of what is to be illustrated. However, the challenge might be page pace and composition to appropriately convey and capture the assignment.

Lets take your description as an example:
Full page or Half page illustration of a battle scene where characters Mages and Psychics plus a few TW PA pilots,a robot and a GB are combating some Brodkil or Gargoyles. OK, Now this scene already has a ton of elements that need to be properly conveyed. That's where the planning and sketching goes into affect (speaking for my personal preference of approach). Now you described role playing wise and correctly imho, how a Psychic or Mage should be participating in a combative scenario via, safe as possible and far enough away from the brawling or physically engaging combatants.

However, from an Artist standpoint, establishing this shot effectively requires depth, appropriate perspective and a nice composition.

A. Place the Psychic/Mage in the fore front and pushing the heavier combatants into the background,

B. Place the combatants up closer and push the Psychic/Mage into the far background.

Both A & B work in a role playing scenario, but visually in a blk and white book that is roughly 8 X10.5 inches, they short sell the distant O.C.C.s to the Gamers.

Thus you might see more often than not a chaotic fight scene where all the OCCs requested are mixing it up so that they each sell the character class. Similar to what you would expect to see in a XMen, Avengers or Justice League comic book with a team battle scene. It might not be as ideal via role playing, but it is visually more stimulating and doesn't short sell the less combative OCCs. TO sort of seal the deal ,maybe the scene illustrated depicts an ambush or that the cast were run down, so the Psychic/Mage did not have enough time to establish safer grounds. The key is to develop story for such scenes so that it begins to gel and makes sense. this will help root the composition and can be used as an Artist's personal guide lines for what they are illustrating.

Every Artist has their own personal approach to such challenges.

[Premier]

Thanks for the kind and encouraging words GK!
Us Artist enjoy a good read that stimulates creative illustrations and production. Such steps I know I have experienced with KS, Alex, Wayne and Jeff Burke. Only with a few other companies that I have worked with, know how to opportunistically take advantage of a studio production team mindset. Others operate more like a robotic assembly line, but miss out on the creative discussions and fine tuning of a creative team. There are still things I would personally like to see happen with us Freelancers as far as PB art goes, but I think we are getting off to a solid start, I hope.

I'm soooooooooooo excited to get NG1 and 2...almost exclusively for the art...

We Artists are thrilled to hear such positive energy and support, but I assure you, the Writing for these titles is just as good, IMHO. I am learning far more about Writing and it truly is an art form all to its self. Withe proper writing a cool drawing comes to life for me. That same drawing can just be a lifeless drawing without the proper Writing to support it. I also confess that I am not fond of cool Writing that has poor artwork to reflect and support it. Always seeking that balance.

Just envisioning Xiticix assaults now with the writing in NG1 & 2 will never be the same for me. I really want to see the best RIFTS Earth campaign that conducts the best Bug Hunt in a hive unfold. hmmm... An idea is brewing...

[BuzzardB]

We Artists are thrilled to hear such positive energy and support, but I assure you, the Writing for these titles is just as good, IMHO. I am learning far more about Writing and it truly is an art form all to its self. Withe proper writing a cool drawing comes to life for me. That same drawing can just be a lifeless drawing without the proper Writing to support it. I also confess that I am not fond of cool Writing that has poor artwork to reflect and support it. Always seeking that balance.

Just envisioning Xiticix assaults now with the writing in NG1 & 2 will never be the same for me. I really want to see the best RIFTS Earth campaign that conducts the best Bug Hunt in a hive unfold. hmmm... An idea is brewing...

Oh for sure. Luckily I don't think I have ever been disappointed by a Rifts books fluff either, even ones with subject matter I'm uninterested in. The art really sucks me in and the writing keeps me there. I have NO worries that NG1/2 will disapoint in any department (except the wallet department).


Actually placed my order via flgs today.

[Premier]

After having a chance to read NG2 now fully there is some really amazing artwork in it the new samson picture is great. Still basic shape of a samson we have seen before but this time it actually sports the rail gun and a pretty mean looking one too and it is also standing next to a person not in armor so you can see the relative size. One thing I notice is chuck seems to work foot troopers in with a lot of his armor/vehicle pictures which is great because its a lot easier to get a feel of the mass of something for players and GM's when you can put it next to something your brain "gets". You see something standing next to a person you know that persons height could vary but you still get a solid feel for how big something is.

Thank You Kaid!!!
I am proud of the entire Art Production Team for these titles! I see everyone coming into their own and I see growth. That's what you are also seeing in my more recent work, via the added troopers/personnel for scale and atmosphere. That was a lesson I picked up via Industrial & Concept Design. As Artists, We are always learning, testing and applying what we see fit, in order to improve our visual expressions. Some techniques simply take longer than others. So glad you are appreciating the hard work!

For things like the extra gun mount on the hover train I just wrote that off as they had added one of the turret upgrades. No reason the engine of a hover train could not mount the same or similar modular turret mounts the other cars can.

I too suggest the easy fix to change the number of turrets from 1 to 2.

Overall the art over the years for palladium has been excellent. Some artists are more stylized and some are more technical about accuracy but for the most part most art in rifts while maybe not strictly "cannon" has been typically accurate enough for use by GM's and players.

Hopefully the artwork will continue to be more accurate to convey the essence of the gamelines that we enjoy. That is what I seek and I am confident that the current roster does as well. I must admit however, WE can only do so much. Some designs that were illustrated in the past simply have not been the strongest foundation, for us to build upon, but because I hold them as canon, I use them as reference for consistency reasons. SO inherited design flaws might come with that territory, sigh...

I can't tell you how many roughs I went through trying to properly fit a human pilot inside the Samson X9 that also was consistent with the previous Samson depictions. ARGGHH...the pain...the pain... I had to wrap my mind around this first before I could finish a single Samson PA of that larger scale class. Nearly every design still placed the pilot's arms in a crazy or unpractical position or unorthodox form of technology just to justify the arm positions. I couldn't get away from the more logical 4 arm PA designs similar to the Triax Jaeger or Appleseed Landmate configurations as the only feasible option for this scale PA. Sure, I could have just drawn some Samson PA design and said oh well, the guys before me got away with it without having to explain it away, but this issue really bugged me. No way could I just throw in a 4 armed Samson(2 pilot arms and 2 larger PA copycat configuration) for the iconic Samson and say that's a Samson. The Rifts fanbase and KS wouldn't hear of it nor easily accept that as the classic, even if it made more sense.

Finally, I was able to figure it out. Even completed an illustration that shows a novice Samson PA pilot inside a Samson PA frame I call the NG-T11. It has a NG PA Trainer walking along side it. The pain....the pain... Figured hey, Top Gun was cool for training jet fighters into enhanced aerial dog-fighting combat, why not have NG have a PA training facility that teaches pilots form novice to advanced classes. Heck if the Robodome arena is there, with all of its events, why not PA Trainers. Certainly a nice place to retire and get paid if you have the skills to teach other or to go and pick up new PA skills and tactics. I even began to write-up some technical side notes and info on the Samson configurations. The biggest distinction was discussing HUH versus HIH PA configurations. HUH (Head-under-Helmet) and HIH (Head-in-Helmet) was basically, if your pilot's compartment places the pilot's head underneath a robotic sensor suite helmet versus the more common widespread PA configuration where the pilot's actual head is inside the PA helmet. There are pros and cons to these configurations, but hey they both made sense to me.

Well..., with the chronic delay for NG2 and the maxed out page count, guess what didn't make the edit due to space...ARGHHHHH....!!!! The pain... Back to the House of pain..!!! More than likely I will post the illustration in my deviantart gallery once NG2 gets out more.

There were other designs (mostly other vehicles) that didn't make the final edit. Hey, I am glad KS made the executive decision at the end of the day as the product didn't need any further reasons for delays.

[Premier]

I would like it if the art is considered to be accurate with the text as written. Also like other people have mentioned art that is low quality, or no art provided at all, can diminish the overall quality of the book.

I know that art has caused problems in the past for some players, mostly with vehicles/PA, not just with weapons but even simple things like "where the heck is the door" or "how to I get inside this Robot/PA".

Do people always make the robots sit down first, is there an elevator hidden in the leg, an outside elevator (like NASA) that leads to an opening ? I ask because I am not really familiar with their use, because I don't use them, but I don't ever recall reading in the write up on how to get in, just how many people it can hold/takes to operate it.
If I am wrong, someone please point it out to me so I can read it.

I know there are a couple of examples for getting into PA, I always just assume that either the chest or back open up and you climb inside.

Razzinold, I agree that some things (like vehicle accessibility) do need to be illustrated or at least described for the ease of understanding and playability. with so many vast robot designs and manufacturers/producers, I wouldn't even know where to begin as there are different bases of technology for Robots vehicles.

I tend to think that access via chest or back are the most likely configurations. Now if a robot has to kneel for the parked position or lay down flat on its back to have accessibility, makes for intriguing role playing experiences and scenarios, that as a GM, I would be sure to have Pilots experience. Maybe depending on the type of robot morphology, the "park" feature is customized and initially up to the pilot to choose and have programmed. However, once programmed that's what they are working with, unless upgraded or augmented by an Operator. So maybe they get to choose from several options
A: Robot crouches
B: Laying down if applicable - lying on back or chest
C: Recoil line and platform that the pilot can remotely uncoil from a locked hatch that safely reels him and or team up into entry

...etc.

The fun is in the vast ideas that can stem from the interaction in the field. Does a pilot have to worry about covering up a robot laying down or one that is simply kneeling, when he is laying low? Does a pilot have to worry about the creature that is crawling on his chest or his back, that worry certainly increases wherever the hatch is. Does damage to the back mean more exposure and environmentally compromised if the rear access is damaged or is it the front and the pilot is good to go. How does a pilot who comes back to his hidden robot that is programmed solely for chest entry get inside if the robot has been flipped over onto its chest by a passing monster, dragon or a robot pilot prankster?

Man I had some goodies even for the NG armor plating that didn't make the final cut as well, sigh... Shock Armor plating, Reinforced MDC plating, Stealth Plating - via Chameleon Camera Stereoscopic plating with limited record and refresh loading, etc.

In the end, Have fun.

[Premier]

I would like it if the art is considered to be accurate with the text as written. Also like other people have mentioned art that is low quality, or no art provided at all, can diminish the overall quality of the book.

I know that art has caused problems in the past for some players, mostly with vehicles/PA, not just with weapons but even simple things like "where the heck is the door" or "how to I get inside this Robot/PA".

Do people always make the robots sit down first, is there an elevator hidden in the leg, an outside elevator (like NASA) that leads to an opening ? I ask because I am not really familiar with their use, because I don't use them, but I don't ever recall reading in the write up on how to get in, just how many people it can hold/takes to operate it.
If I am wrong, someone please point it out to me so I can read it.

I know there are a couple of examples for getting into PA, I always just assume that either the chest or back open up and you climb inside.

This is one reason I like chucks art so much is for bigger robots and vehicles it is usually pretty obvious how you would go about entering them. Most of the examples of PA we have seen "unbuttoned involve the chest plate opening up and them basically climbing in that way given power armor is powered body armor most would work like this. Some odd ones like the samson/delila which are way bigger than man sized now show a bit more clearly the pilots positioning in them and describe the driving position better which helps understand how they get in and drive it.

Thanks Kaid, I try to picture myself as a pilot gamer and what I would seek and that includes such factors as accessibility. PAs are a bit more challenging. After reading John Steakley's "Armor", they are so convenient in some ways, but man what happens if your PA's power supply is damaged or disconnected and you can't get it open and all that PA weight is placed on your body? You are instantly crushed if you don't lay down and wait for help. BTW, the Delilah is a HIH design, but the Samson is a HUH, so their pilot configurations are different because the chest and shoulders of the Delilah are smaller so that pilot can reach the sensors and sleeve servos and joint alignment works easier. The Samson is a bigger boy in dimensions, so I had to keep it HUH.

[drewkitty ~..~]

It was an RT game but...it is sort of on topic.....

It is the new Gen. era and I play a ex-agent (civ. detective class) of the masters that turned to commerce/trading to make her way in life. Now in the TV series they show that to transform a Cyclone from cycle to PA mode you flip a switch on the handlebars, but never show how to transform back. So I work that into the game with my char asking the UEEF char (the NPC) 'how to bleep bleep do you change it back?' Saying that it was easy to watch the marine how to change to PA mode. Having seen the marine do to several times already. My char needed to get it off before in a hurry cause of a tinkle issue. And thus my char got instructed on how to change modes back to Cycle mode.

Mod note: I was telling a story not actually using swearwords.

[Pepsi Jedi]

Well..., with the chronic delay for NG2 and the maxed out page count, guess what didn't make the edit due to space...ARGHHHHH....!!!! The pain... Back to the House of pain..!!! More than likely I will post the illustration in my deviantart gallery once NG2 gets out more.

There were other designs (mostly other vehicles) that didn't make the final edit. Hey, I am glad KS made the executive decision at the end of the day as the product didn't need any further reasons for delays.

I'd love to see the work that didn't make the book. Love your stuff and I'm not scared to Stat it out myself. lol.

[Pepsi Jedi]

I would like it if the art is considered to be accurate with the text as written. Also like other people have mentioned art that is low quality, or no art provided at all, can diminish the overall quality of the book.

I know that art has caused problems in the past for some players, mostly with vehicles/PA, not just with weapons but even simple things like "where the heck is the door" or "how to I get inside this Robot/PA".

Do people always make the robots sit down first, is there an elevator hidden in the leg, an outside elevator (like NASA) that leads to an opening ? I ask because I am not really familiar with their use, because I don't use them, but I don't ever recall reading in the write up on how to get in, just how many people it can hold/takes to operate it.
If I am wrong, someone please point it out to me so I can read it.

I know there are a couple of examples for getting into PA, I always just assume that either the chest or back open up and you climb inside.

Razzinold, I agree that some things (like vehicle accessibility) do need to be illustrated or at least described for the ease of understanding and playability. with so many vast robot designs and manufacturers/producers, I wouldn't even know where to begin as there are different bases of technology for Robots vehicles.

I tend to think that access via chest or back are the most likely configurations. Now if a robot has to kneel for the parked position or lay down flat on its back to have accessibility, makes for intriguing role playing experiences and scenarios, that as a GM, I would be sure to have Pilots experience. Maybe depending on the type of robot morphology, the "park" feature is customized and initially up to the pilot to choose and have programmed. However, once programmed that's what they are working with, unless upgraded or augmented by an Operator. So maybe they get to choose from several options
A: Robot crouches
B: Laying down if applicable - lying on back or chest
C: Recoil line and platform that the pilot can remotely uncoil from a locked hatch that safely reels him and or team up into entry

...etc.

The fun is in the vast ideas that can stem from the interaction in the field. Does a pilot have to worry about covering up a robot laying down or one that is simply kneeling, when he is laying low? Does a pilot have to worry about the creature that is crawling on his chest or his back, that worry certainly increases wherever the hatch is. Does damage to the back mean more exposure and environmentally compromised if the rear access is damaged or is it the front and the pilot is good to go. How does a pilot who comes back to his hidden robot that is programmed solely for chest entry get inside if the robot has been flipped over onto its chest by a passing monster, dragon or a robot pilot prankster?

Man I had some goodies even for the NG armor plating that didn't make the final cut as well, sigh... Shock Armor plating, Reinforced MDC plating, Stealth Plating - via Chameleon Camera Stereoscopic plating with limited record and refresh loading, etc.

In the end, Have fun.

We've had this come up in our games before. Usually when trying to get on/in someone ELSES robot vehicle or what not. It can propose a challenge.

Interestingly enough, the game "Titanfall" Showed a rather unique version of this. Where in the robot itself had a preprogramed series of moves. Basically the bot reaches down and grabs the pilot, opens it's on chest and stuffs the pilot in there. Which is some what amusing. You really don't want to lose your key fob if your bot works that way. Some other guy could hit the remote, and be grabbed and stuffed into YOUR robot.

I do like the bots that Chuck has made. As many have pointed out you can see the way people move around on/get in them. You see grab bars and little ladder steps here and there. You can see how they're NOT put around the joints, least they snag and what not. Depending on the bot you can also tell when he goes for angles and what not 1) to deflect incoming fire and 2) Not snag on things while moving. Intrestingly enough, Some of the bots, do NOT have those, so when you see them you know it's a purposeful design choice. "Ok that bot over there could be a bit sneaky (Compariativly) but this boy.. oh.. this one.. he don't sneak. he plows through.

Either way, Chuck's stuff looks like..... "tough" doesn't really cover it. It IS tough but...... Chucks creations... Look like they could -Take a punch-. . As if a dragon came down and landed and hissed at one of Chuck's bots, you can almost hear the pilot inside flipping on his speaker and screaming out "COME AT ME BRO!!" as he waded right on in there to frak that dragon up. Be it with the weapons or just reaching out and punching the dragon in the face. And his designs look like they could take a counter punch/claw by said dragon and not break into a million pieces.

I love the CWC. That's pretty well established, but when you look at the glitter boy killer, you kinda just tilt your head and wonder how it doesn't' break apart at about 10 joints.

Chucks bots look like they could be air dropped in. Hit the side of a mountain. Roll down, plowing a furrow in the rock and trees. fall off a 50 foot cliff. Land on a bolder and fall into a river. Then get up. Wipe off the muck. Rotate a shoulder and then nod and go on about their mission. I love that. They might not be the absolute fastest looking, most sleek looking, most 'beautiful'. But they look like they'd survive. Even if you had to get out with a wielding torch and some duct tape from time to time. Which, is if you read the text, exactly what NG prides itself on and why people buy NG gear. "Tough and Works Every Time"