So what American remnants still exist on Rifts Earth?

[Cyber-Knight]

OR he might have been one of those NEMA officers who had Squilb fighting alongside him during the Dark Ages and realize that D-Bee's can be good people, to.

[Mech-Viper Prime]

"We will be the army of the New Republic that will restore peace and prosperity to our great nation. We are the hope for the future and we will not fail in that duty."

He didn't say they'd build an empire, but a republic. That's a pretty strong hint that he believes and supports the Constitution. It's ridiculous to suggest, then, that he'd embrace an organization like the Coalition. Just look at the Republicans. They despise the Coalition for their practices, and they're still somewhat of a human supremacist organization. So even if Emmel were too end up having human supremacist views (Which isn't likely, given that D-Bee's of North America tells us that the Squilb, at least, worked with NEMA during the Dark Ages), that doesn't mean he'd embrace the Coalition, as he'd despise the practices of the Coalition government. It's certainly not a government which he or any of his people would want to subject themselves to.

You mean like
The Democratic People's Republic of Korea
People's Republic of China
Islamic Republic of Iran
Which type of republic are you talking about

[Cyber-Knight]

The republic he grew up in, or did you suddenly forget that he's an American?

[Mech-Viper Prime]

OR he might have been one of those NEMA officers who had Squilb fighting alongside him during the Dark Ages and realize that D-Bee's can be good people, to.

Too bad the book disagrees with that

[Cyber-Knight]

Disagrees how? They're not mentioned, neither are however many adventures Emmel and his people had before they got to the HQ-ECC. That doesn't mean that those adventures didn't happen, though, and that he couldn't have worked alongside Squilb or other D-Bee's along the way.

[taalismn]

Disagrees how? They're not mentioned, neither are however many adventures Emmel and his people had before they got to the HQ-ECC. That doesn't mean that those adventures didn't happen, though, and that he couldn't have worked alongside Squilb or other D-Bee's along the way.

I'll grant that it isn't mentioned, but the vibe I get is that the 'adventures' they had were mostly of the 'send teams out to find out what happened, never see them again aside from some 'Blair Witch'-style video ending in "AUGG-!"' sort. If they had encountered non-human allies, they might have stayed out longer, hoping to gather more allies/resources and make a stand of it in real-time.
Your scenario is possible, but unlikely. It does, however, suggest one of many possible alternate paths the history of Rifts Earth may have taken, starting at Day One.

[Mech-Viper Prime]

Disagrees how? They're not mentioned, neither are however many adventures Emmel and his people had before they got to the HQ-ECC. That doesn't mean that those adventures didn't happen, though, and that he couldn't have worked alongside Squilb or other D-Bee's along the way.

its under the note section, page of wb30
ice cube brigade has never meet them

[Cyber-Knight]

its under the note section, page of wb30
ice cube brigade has never meet them

Ah ok, you're right. That doesn't change anything regarding the Coalition, though.

It could've been a possibility given that 24,000 of the soldiers who were frozen didn't start off in that base but rather had to fight their way across the continent to get there, but I guess not. Still, NEMA troops DID fight alongside the Squilb and other D-Bee's. I very much doubt that someone like Emmel would be that dissimilar to NEMA officers like that.

[Mech-Viper Prime]

its under the note section, page of wb30
ice cube brigade has never meet them

Ah ok, you're right. That doesn't change anything regarding the Coalition, though.

It could've been a possibility given that 24,000 of the soldiers who were frozen didn't start off in that base but rather had to fight their way across the continent to get there, but I guess not. Still, NEMA troops DID fight alongside the Squilb and other D-Bee's. I very much doubt that someone like Emmel would be that dissimilar to NEMA officers like that.

Depends on their arrive point and what nema forces they encounter, because they know the symbols

[keir451]

Now to be fair, Gen. Emmel & his troops DID go into stasis when the world was being overrun by nasty demons & monsters, so there might not have been enough time for him to establish the idea of a "good" vs. "bad" being. So on waking up he'd find a more stabilised world than when he went into stasis, but FAR more of these *d-bees* than he originally figured and he MIGHT be a hard liner that might like the CS (at least on the surface). Sure he's sworn the same oaths as all military personnel (or did he, we don't know for sure that NEMA follows the same standards our military does) but his attitude may be that all these aliens are interlopers, then again he could be a more *interpretive* kinda General and say "Well, we've got wannabe human fascists here (the CS), two city states (Lazlo &New Lazlo) that at least practice in some recognizable form the values I'm sworn to uphold, but they've elected a Dragon (WTH?) to their council and other, also militant, city sates (Northern Gun, etc.) and at my back a rather deranged AI with questionable goals. Hmmm which one do I choose?"
I come down on the side of "giving creatures the intelligence they were born with" as my old Gm used to say. Which means that I play Gen. Emmel as a man of (possibly) high intelligence who's not going to go off half cocked and will take the time to avail himself of all them data Archie has collected over the years, he might have Hagan locked up, initially, and then either kept under surveillance or exiled from the base.
As for contacting the New Navy, the Navy has their own High Command so they wouldn't have to answer to a General, their Admirals would tell him to take a hike. Nemo might defer to him on land as Nemo's only a Captain, but at sea on the Ticonderoga Nemo's in command NOT the General. Also the New Navy has their own gov't too.
Until Kevin (or some one else) stats Gen. Emmel out it's all subject to personal interpretation.

I agree , but he might look lazlo and new lazlo as a mockey too as well as looking at the d-bees as invaders too.

Yeah, at this point he could go either way. I admit my personal bias is that he'd keep Archie in place, link up w/ the New Navy as well as Lazlo & New Lazlo, eliminate the Republican's Director (and in the process help them get their heads straight) and eventually whomp the Coaltion. This is based soley on the fact that I'm tired of every other group being listed as, effectively, "bad guys" and want ot see some clear cut White Hats for once.
While Gen. Emmel might not be too dissimilar to other NEMA officers, the ONLY one we know ANYTHING about is Lt. Gen. Sawyer from Chaos Earth and her situation was somewhat unique and the Chaos Earth books (IIRC) don't mention NEMA fighting alongsdie the aliens they encountered, typically it seems they practiced passive containment "This is our territory, please do not come into it." sorta thing, now Lt.Gen. Sawyer DID create the Para Arcane as a specialist divison of NEMA for the purpose of helping NEMA to idnetify and deal w/ the various threats and major issues of that time. I don't know if this was done by ALL NEMA everywhere.

[taalismn]

its under the note section, page of wb30
ice cube brigade has never meet them

Ah ok, you're right. That doesn't change anything regarding the Coalition, though.

It could've been a possibility given that 24,000 of the soldiers who were frozen didn't start off in that base but rather had to fight their way across the continent to get there, but I guess not. Still, NEMA troops DID fight alongside the Squilb and other D-Bee's. I very much doubt that someone like Emmel would be that dissimilar to NEMA officers like that.

Depends on individual and circumstance. The Golden Age was supposed to be enlightened, and that may have extended to organization and management. So ideally, NEMA being the best of the best, were screened and trained a lot better, with the lessons learned from our own age. But even today, official organizations like the military and the police have a range of personalities and attitudes ranging from cool-headed and tolerant to the bad apples one incident short of a discharge.
However, NEMA was NOT trained for dealing with a catastrophe that looks like literally Hell on Earth, Godzilla, and Alien Invasion all on one day. People will snap, crackle, and pop, and while some will truly rise to the occasion(especially if they discover latent telekinetics), others will coast on denial and shock, and still others will go completely bad. Some will see kindred spirits in other embattled lifeforms and seize the opportunities afforded therein, while others will assume a 'kill anything and everything that you don't know before it gets you first' position. NEMA training just might allow them to hold out mentally a bit longer than the civilians.

[Cyber-Knight]

Well, as long as we're talking about personal biases, mine is for an alliance between the following powers:

The Republicans
The NEMA Army
The New Navy
The Megaversal Legion
Freedom Station
The Squilbs

NEMA, the New Navy, and the Megaversal Legion alone provide 850,000 military personnel! At least 330,000 of those are ground troops (I don't remember if Underseas mentioned what percentage of the 520,000 in the New Navy were sailors versus Marines), all of which are equipped with gear more technologically advanced than the Coalition. Then add in however many troops the Republicans have at their disposal plus the tens of thousands of Squilb who'd join the cause, and we're probably looking at a pretty solid half-a-million strong army. And if they can take over ARCHIE-3, hoo boy! Add in legions of robot soldiers to the mix. They could easily become a continental power.

[Mech-Viper Prime]

Well, as long as we're talking about personal biases, mine is for an alliance between the following powers:

The Republicans
The NEMA Army
The New Navy
The Megaversal Legion
Freedom Station
The Squilbs

NEMA, the New Navy, and the Megaversal Legion alone provide 850,000 military personnel! At least 330,000 of those are ground troops (I don't remember if Underseas mentioned what percentage of the 520,000 in the New Navy were sailors versus Marines), all of which are equipped with gear more technologically advanced than the Coalition. Then add in however many troops the Republicans have at their disposal plus the tens of thousands of Squilb who'd join the cause, and we're probably looking at a pretty solid half-a-million strong army. And if they can take over ARCHIE-3, hoo boy! Add in legions of robot soldiers to the mix. They could easily become a continental power.

And the next target for Atlantis

[Cyber-Knight]

People will snap, crackle, and pop, and while some will truly rise to the occasion(especially if they discover latent telekinetics), others will coast on denial and shock, and still others will go completely bad. Some will see kindred spirits in other embattled lifeforms and seize the opportunities afforded therein, while others will assume a 'kill anything and everything that you don't know before it gets you first' position. NEMA training just might allow them to hold out mentally a bit longer than the civilians.

True, although judging by the bits from Sourcebook One, I don't see anything to indicate that Emmel had cracked. What was described their seemed like the thought process of a pretty level-headed individual.

And the next target for Atlantis

You keep throwing Atlantis around. If they were a problem then explain why they haven't taken out the Coalition. Or Free Quebec. Or Tolkeen. Or Lazlo. Or New Lazlo. Or the Vampire Kingdoms. Or New Camelot. Or the NGR. Or Japan. Or the THOUSANDS of other human nations and city-states out there. Why do you think they'd target this specific group of humans while disregarding all those others, not to mention their ancient archenemies the vampire intelligences?

[Mech-Viper Prime]

People will snap, crackle, and pop, and while some will truly rise to the occasion(especially if they discover latent telekinetics), others will coast on denial and shock, and still others will go completely bad. Some will see kindred spirits in other embattled lifeforms and seize the opportunities afforded therein, while others will assume a 'kill anything and everything that you don't know before it gets you first' position. NEMA training just might allow them to hold out mentally a bit longer than the civilians.

True, although judging by the bits from Sourcebook One, I don't see anything to indicate that Emmel had cracked. What was described their seemed like the thought process of a pretty level-headed individual.

And the next target for Atlantis

You keep throwing Atlantis around. If they were a problem then explain why they haven't taken out the Coalition. Or Free Quebec. Or Tolkeen. Or Lazlo. Or New Lazlo. Or the Vampire Kingdoms. Or New Camelot. Or the NGR. Or Japan. Or the THOUSANDS of other human nations and city-states out there. Why do you think they'd target this specific group of humans while disregarding all those others, not to mention their ancient archenemies the vampire intelligences?

He wasn't , he seems like that type of person, but his troops were or starting to.

Last time a human kingdom openly embarrassed them was the republicans and doing the following battle they removed that kingdom at least with the retcon, but before the retcon they targeted Archie-3 kingdom he builded and was their god

[taalismn]

Well, as long as we're talking about personal biases, mine is for an alliance between the following powers:

The Republicans
The NEMA Army
The New Navy
The Megaversal Legion
Freedom Station
The Squilbs .

No Tundra Rangers to watch the northern reaches?
They may not have much in the way of blatant offensive firepower, but they got survival skills and rangers.
Toss in Lazlo for political idealism, good public relations, and the wild card of all those affiliated adventurer groups.
Swinging MercTown to your side is also a good idea...getting all those mercs on retainer, rather than against you, is a good diea, especially if your overall scheme means opportunity for loot(like a Splugorth city or somesuch).

And if you've freed the NEMA Army, and you managed to turn the Toaster....factor in the -Shemarrians-.

[taalismn]

[
You keep throwing Atlantis around. If they were a problem then explain why they haven't taken out the Coalition. Or Free Quebec. Or Tolkeen. Or Lazlo. Or New Lazlo. Or the Vampire Kingdoms. Or New Camelot. Or the NGR. Or Japan. Or the THOUSANDS of other human nations and city-states out there. Why do you think they'd target this specific group of humans while disregarding all those others, not to mention their ancient archenemies the vampire intelligences?

Splynncryth doesn't wipe them out because essentially a) they're entertaining, b) wiping them out would entail a war that would, at the current level of preparedness, and the nuclear capabilities of the CS, wind up tearing apart a lot of real estate Sokynncryth would rather not have ruined...his happy hunting grounds and a lucrative source of income. The Big Eyeball doesn't want to poison his garden; Rifts Earth is like a resort world to him, or a big potential-filled resource he's exploiting.
Yes, if everybody piled on Atlantis, they MIGHT be able to tear Splynncryth a new one, and maybe even make him cut his immediate losses and run offworld, But if Splynncryth REALLY wanted to hold on, or just ruin everybody's day, he could committ his ENTIRE resource-base, ALL his minion-manpower, to the effort and make victory for the Terries a phyrric one. But that would leave him wide open to his competitors, and anybody else who might suddenly notice where he's been spending his time....everybody from other rival; Alien Intelligences to pesky CosmoKnights.

[Mech-Viper Prime]

[
You keep throwing Atlantis around. If they were a problem then explain why they haven't taken out the Coalition. Or Free Quebec. Or Tolkeen. Or Lazlo. Or New Lazlo. Or the Vampire Kingdoms. Or New Camelot. Or the NGR. Or Japan. Or the THOUSANDS of other human nations and city-states out there. Why do you think they'd target this specific group of humans while disregarding all those others, not to mention their ancient archenemies the vampire intelligences?

Splynncryth doesn't wipe them out because essentially a) they're entertaining, b) wiping them out would entail a war that would, at the current level of preparedness, and the nuclear capabilities of the CS, wind up tearing apart a lot of real estate Sokynncryth would rather not have ruined...his happy hunting grounds and a lucrative source of income. The Big Eyeball doesn't want to poison his garden; Rifts Earth is like a resort world to him, or a big potential-filled resource he's exploiting.
Yes, if everybody piled on Atlantis, they MIGHT be able to tear Splynncryth a new one, and maybe even make him cut his immediate losses and run offworld, But if Splynncryth REALLY wanted to hold on, or just ruin everybody's day, he could committ his ENTIRE resource-base, ALL his minion-manpower, to the effort and make victory for the Terries a phyrric one. But that would leave him wide open to his competitors, and anybody else who might suddenly notice where he's been spending his time....everybody from other rival; Alien Intelligences to pesky CosmoKnights.

It's his "magic kingdom"

[taalismn]

[It's his "magic kingdom"

Only 'Micky' doesn't hug you; he EATS you.

[Mech-Viper Prime]

[It's his "magic kingdom"

Only 'Micky' doesn't hug you; he EATS you.

Only if you taste good

[taalismn]

[.

Only if you taste good[/quote]



Roughage...and enough(alien equivalent of) ketchup.

But yah, the CS nukes could seriously ruin Splynncryth's day IF they were successfully delivered, and IF Atlantis was hit with way more than the arsenal the CS is likely to have. And an atomic bombardment THAT honking big, I'm sure, would set off all sorts of precognative alarms throughout Splynncryth's security apparatus.

[Mech-Viper Prime]

Only if you taste good

Roughage...and enough(alien equivalent of) ketchup.

But yah, the CS nukes could seriously ruin Splynncryth's day IF they were successfully delivered, and IF Atlantis was hit with way more than the arsenal the CS is likely to have. And an atomic bombardment THAT honking big, I'm sure, would set off all sorts of precognative alarms throughout Splynncryth's security apparatus.

Well we know the number of devices they are able to produce in one year time , or you could just hid his visine and have a crazy throw sand at him

[Mack]

And not to mention, Archie has perfected the ability to capture and turn Skelebots to his side.

Can you give a reference for this?

[Nightmask]

And not to mention, Archie has perfected the ability to capture and turn Skelebots to his side.

Can you give a reference for this?

I'm not sure the exact book but ARCHIE is definitely stated to have replicated skelebots to the point some are in some of the most high security areas of Chi-town, although I'm not sure of the quantities.

[Mech-Viper Prime]

Can you give a reference for this?

The skelebots Archie has taken over, and placed into Chi-Town itself, with 13 I believe it was
that are in the actual thrown room with the Emporer himself.

I forget which book it is in, but I will find it and quote it for you.

Archie made skelebots of his own and got them inside the CS

[Nightmask]

Archie made skelebots of his own and got them inside the CS

Even better, that mean's he can produce them with out having to capture
them and then do all the other junk, which in the end saves time.

And with a force multiplier like that producing tens of thousands of those
and then having them enter a combat zone, in which the CS thinks they are there
for the Coalion, they could literally get right up on the Coalition and never get
shot at till they are literally inside Coaliton forces ranks, tearing them apart!

Their most effective use is espionage and terror rather than straight up combat, sowing distrust and making the human troopers unable to trust their skelebots crippling them as they're forced to sideline or destroy them all to be sure that they're safe.

[Mack]

Can you give a reference for this?

The skelebots Archie has taken over, and placed into Chi-Town itself, with 13 I believe it was
that are in the actual thrown room with the Emporer himself.

I forget which book it is in, but I will find it and quote it for you.

Found it. Aftermath p77.

He infiltrated an vague amount ("number in the hundreds"--which is tiny compared to the total number of Skelebots) into the CS military. Most are in Tolkeen, 15% in the CS Burbs, and 7 units in Chi-Town (not in the Throne Room).

[Cyber-Knight]

Last time a human kingdom openly embarrassed them was the republicans and doing the following battle they removed that kingdom at least with the retcon, but before the retcon they targeted Archie-3 kingdom he builded and was their god

As I posted before, that was the first and last time Splynncryth has ever done something like that. He hasn't eliminated a large kingdom since (Or ever. The New Republic only had an army of 2,000, so that's hardly a large kingdom). And it's not because the current ones haven't been killing his minions, they have. Whatever his reasons for not wanting to upset the apple cart (I.E. Not wanting to upset the other powers who want to keep Rifts Earth as a free zone open to all), that's why he doesn't go after the human kingdoms on Rifts Earth, not because they haven't been openly killing his minions. From Aftermath:

"In a show of force and disdain, Coalition forces are actively hunting Minions of Splugorth and destroying them wherever they are encountered, even if it means allowing D-Bee's caught as slaves to escape their clutches. The Coalition Army will not tolerate these monsters for any reason and trusts their swift action will give the Splugorth reason to give up any ideas about expanding into the Americas."

"The Coalition Army has already clashed with Splugorth Slavers and other Minions on several occasions, and are ramping up operations to purge them from the region. The Minions of Splugorth have quickly risen to the top of the Coalition's list of most dangerous enemies for immediate elimination."

The Coalition has been openly embarassing the Splugorth repeatedly. So should we expect the Splugorth to mount an invasion and wipe them off the map, then?

The skelebots Archie has taken over, and placed into Chi-Town itself, with 13 I believe it was
that are in the actual thrown room with the Emporer himself.

I forget which book it is in, but I will find it and quote it for you.

I think it's he has a handful inside Chi-Town itself, but only one in Prosek's throne room. I wish I could remember what book that was mentioned in, though.

This line up would put a military together that is vastly powerful.

30,000 Nema ground troops.

330,000 Ground troops from the Megaversal legion. (and more then that too)

800,000 from the new navy.

2,000 Sea titans.

But more importantly, this group of allies would have the capability to literally
take on and actually beat almost any other nation on earth minus Atlantis.

Archie production facilities would exponentially increase the overall troop number
via his robot productions.

Archie would also be able to manufacture sub's, Power Armors, Robot vehicles that could
easily rival anything the Coalition is capable of making. And not to mention, Archie has
perfected the ability to capture and turn Skelebots to his side.

In total their operation would entail, Complete detailed Files on every single mover and
shaker in the Coalition's hiarchy, military and otherwise, detailed files on every single
power block in north america.

Archies complete production facilities.

Nemo's entire naval armada. (And his production facilities)

Megaversal legion's capability to get to Phase would (and literally improve everyones
weaponry and armor by huge leaps) and their production facilities Not to mention
thier ability to get anywhere on the planet easily.

This might be thee most powerful human alliance on the planet !

I like it. And collectively they would have the facilities and the production capabilities
to utterly take over the old american empire lines !!

Yep, and don't forget the Squilb. D-Bee's of North America says that 1d4x10,000 are ready and waiting to follow someone who's willing to travel down south into Mexico and fight it out with the Vampire Kingdoms. Imagine how many more are willing and able to follow NEMA if they reappeared? They'd certainly solve the Republicans manpower shortage, given that they have all this gear they built using ARCHIE's factories but don't have the people to operate it all. According to the book they have:

1248 Chroming Guardsman Mk III (800 need pilots)
2496 Chromium Troop Armor (1,664 need pilots)
0212 Golden Eagles

And that's not counting troops in standard Glitter Boys, normal NEMA gear like the Silver Eagles, and infantry in body armor. The Republicans alone add several thousand more troops and, if the Squilb were to join up, then they'd have pilots and operators for all those other war machines.

And if Freedom Station is involved as well then not only do they have access to the Glitter Boy Mk IV design (and its 4d6x10 MD cannon!), but satellite communication, too (albeit ARCHIE-3 has already managed to regain that through a single satellite it's made contact with).

One shudders to think, too, what they could come up with if they pooled their technological resources. Maybe the Men-Rall could create Glitterborgs and provide Inertial Shields to an army of Glitter Boy troops and NEMA power armor. Or replace the 90 MDC standard body armor for the Megaversal Legion soldiers with the 120 MDC NEMA body armor.

All things considered, it'd make for an interesting turn of events. Captain Nemo Dobson, General Anthony Emmel, Colonel Isabelle Copper, Director James Elliot, Colonel Arthur Savage, Warlord Okarr, the Freedom Station Committee, etc, it'd be pretty interesting to see them working together and trying to rebuilt the United States, or at least reclaim the original 13 Colonies.

[Slight001]

Last time a human kingdom openly embarrassed them was the republicans and doing the following battle they removed that kingdom at least with the retcon, but before the retcon they targeted Archie-3 kingdom he builded and was their god

As I posted before, that was the first and last time Splynncryth has ever done something like that. He hasn't eliminated a large kingdom since (Or ever. The New Republic only had an army of 2,000, so that's hardly a large kingdom). And it's not because the current ones haven't been killing his minions, they have. Whatever his reasons for not wanting to upset the apple cart (I.E. Not wanting to upset the other powers who want to keep Rifts Earth as a free zone open to all), that's why he doesn't go after the human kingdoms on Rifts Earth, not because they haven't been openly killing his minions. From Aftermath:

"In a show of force and disdain, Coalition forces are actively hunting Minions of Splugorth and destroying them wherever they are encountered, even if it means allowing D-Bee's caught as slaves to escape their clutches. The Coalition Army will not tolerate these monsters for any reason and trusts their swift action will give the Splugorth reason to give up any ideas about expanding into the Americas."

"The Coalition Army has already clashed with Splugorth Slavers and other Minions on several occasions, and are ramping up operations to purge them from the region. The Minions of Splugorth have quickly risen to the top of the Coalition's list of most dangerous enemies for immediate elimination."

The Coalition has been openly embarassing the Splugorth repeatedly. So should we expect the Splugorth to mount an invasion and wipe them off the map, then?

While the classic forums argument would be that the Coalition has script/plot immunity... a more reasonable argument would be...

If the Splugorth aren't willing to attack the CS over what they've (the CS) been doing then just how much worse was the Republicans attacks upon the Splugorth?

Also if I'm not mistaken weren't the Republicans actually taunting Splynncryth himself? Far as I know the CS is just attacking the Splugorth who encroach on 'their' territory. The Republicans however were trying to embarrass the Splugorth and prove themselves better.

Splynncryth likely see's the CS's actions as nothing more then the price of business. Hells, he might even enjoy the battles as entertainment! Sure the CS wins a few but Splynncryth knows they aren't winning them all and the betting on who's going to win is earning the house (Splynncryth) a mint! The Republicans on the other hand (iirc...) made the mistake of insulting him personally and that he wasn't going to put up with, so he made an example of the fledgling nation.

[Cyber-Knight]

The quote is "Moreover, the upstart nation was making a mockery of the Splugorth by telling other humans they could keep them safe. In a fit of rage from a bruised ego, Lord Splynncryth of Atlantis dispatched 20,000 of his best troops, mostly Kittani and Power Lords, to teach them a lesson. The NEMA militia was outnumbered ten to one, they never had a chance."

So nah, they weren't taunting Splynncryth himself. They were "making a mockery" of him in that they were successfuly resisting him, not that they were personally lobbing insults his way. I think what we have to look at here is the situation, namely that this all occured 60 years after the Great Cataclysm, in 2158 AD, or -126 PA. This was LONG before any meaningful human civilization established itself on Earth and shortly after the Splugorth had laid claim to Atlantis. This was also long before other major megaversal powers had taken notice of Rifts Earth and decided that it should stay a free zone accessible to all. So at the time Splynncryth was far more free to act on his whims then he is now. The New Republic had a meager military and was probably the ONLY power in North America, so attacking them represented a low risk proposition for him. Nowadays, though, there are multiple large powers in North America who'd take issue with a major Atlantean assault on North America, as well as other megaversal powers who'd take issue with the Splugorth extending their influence beyond Atlantis. Simply put, he's not as free to act now as he was before. So while the Coalition is committing the same act which the Republicans did, "making a mockery of the Splugorth" by telling the Humans in the walls of Chi-Town that they could keep them safe, he doesn't act because doing so now would be opening up a hornet's nest which he doesn't need, both from all the other powers on North America (Free Quebec, Lazlo, New Lazlo, Psyscape, etc), to potentially incurring the wrath of other megaversal powers who might view a major attack like that on his part as a bid for a Splugorth takeover of Rifts Earth and move to stop him.

[Cyber-Knight]

In that light, then, ANY power on Rifts Earth is vulnerable to annihilation at the hands of the Splugorth. Mech-Viper Prime was arguing that the NEMA troops would be automatically targeted for destruction, but there's no good reason whatsoever why they'd be singled out for destruction in comparison to the Coalition or Free Quebec, both of which have been regularly targeting Minions of Splugorth.

I don't think, though, that 60 years after the Great Cataclysm that whatever these great powers were would've already decided on Earth being a free zone because of just how chaotic the planet still was. The Splugorth moved in because they saw an opportunity and because Atlantis was barren and lifeless, but the same wasn't true for the rest of the planet. It was enmeshed in ley line energy with demon swarms pouring through from all over the place. Rifts Earth couldn't serve as a free zone for megaversal travel because it was just far too dangerous a place. It only became good for that later on when the ley line activity died down from the horrendous damage it had been inflicting before. That, then, would be when other major powers would decide that Rifts Earth should be a free zone for travel, as it wouldn't be until then that it'd actually become useful. Before that, though, it'd be far too dangerous for anyone other than the Splugorth on Atlantis.

[Mech-Viper Prime]

In that light, then, ANY power on Rifts Earth is vulnerable to annihilation at the hands of the Splugorth. Mech-Viper Prime was arguing that the NEMA troops would be automatically targeted for destruction, but there's no good reason whatsoever why they'd be singled out for destruction in comparison to the Coalition or Free Quebec, both of which have been regularly targeting Minions of Splugorth.

lets see i wasnt agruing , just stating what has happened before. but hey lets go down this road ,there will be another human kingdom in almost the same general area using the same exact equipment as before, in the middle of shemarrian country , a group of cyborg warrior women who has been giving him problems that he doesn't whether to be mad about or laugh at.

Ahh it must be a ploy while they slow rebuilt they little kingdom, sneaky little humans, he laughs, next day he puts plans in motion to remove them once and for all.

[Cyber-Knight]

And I pointed out that the situation before isn't at all the same as the situation in the present. And you really think he'd go all-out on them because of their equipment?!? You do realize, right, that the Coalition and Free Quebec also uses a lot of the same equipment? Moreover, taking out 2,000 militiamen is not the same as taking out an army of 30,000 soldiers who're even better equipped, particularly if they're supported by robot armies. Where have the Splugorth EVER made an assault that large? And why would they launch an attack on them all the while disregarding the attacks which they've suffered at the hands of the Coalition and Free Quebec? Again I have to ask you why you think that is. Is it because you think they have a vulnerability to death's head motifs? Do they take double damage and inflict only half damage against people wearing skulls or something? Is that why they don't move against the Coalition even though Coalition troops have been actively engaging in killing Minions of Splugorth? Is that also why they don't go after Free Quebec, which has been attacking Minions of Splugorth along the eastern seaboard? Because they used to wear skulls and they still derive the magical benefit from that 2d4x10 months after removing that iconography from their gear as it takes that long for their Plot Armor to completely fade away? Why in the world do you think the Splugorth would focus on this one single group of humans who just appeared out of nowhere all while ignoring every other group which has spent the past few decades killing his minions whenever the opportunity arose?

[Mech-Viper Prime]

And I pointed out that the situation before isn't at all the same as the situation in the present. And you really think he'd go all-out on them because of their equipment?!? You do realize, right, that the Coalition and Free Quebec also uses a lot of the same equipment? Moreover, taking out 2,000 militiamen is not the same as taking out an army of 30,000 soldiers who're even better equipped, particularly if they're supported by robot armies. Where have the Splugorth EVER made an assault that large? And why would they launch an attack on them all the while disregarding the attacks which they've suffered at the hands of the Coalition and Free Quebec? Again I have to ask you why you think that is. Is it because you think they have a vulnerability to death's head motifs? Do they take double damage and inflict only half damage against people wearing skulls or something? Is that why they don't move against the Coalition even though Coalition troops have been actively engaging in killing Minions of Splugorth? Is that also why they don't go after Free Quebec, which has been attacking Minions of Splugorth along the eastern seaboard? Because they used to wear skulls and they still derive the magical benefit from that 2d4x10 months after removing that iconography from their gear as it takes that long for their Plot Armor to completely fade away? Why in the world do you think the Splugorth would focus on this one single group of humans who just appeared out of nowhere all while ignoring every other group which has spent the past few decades killing his minions whenever the opportunity arose?

because put the east coast has been a source of embarrassment , first that little kingdom of humans, now the she-ra robots, and an army popping up in the middle of a area of warrior who dont take kind to trespassers but allowing this army to operate with their terrority. hmmm.

as for the coalition , like i said before , they are doing a smash and grab job , grabbing magic stuff and slaves, and he is doing this in a former war zone, so he accepts the coalition if going to try to stop his forces , but the payday of the operation is too good to pass up

[Cyber-Knight]

Right, because having his troops being killed by the hundreds if not thousands by the Coalition ISN'T embarassing, but having his troops killed by humans on the east coast over 230 years ago is something he's still smarting over. Really, now?

If anything is true about Splynncryth, though, it's this. He doesn't want to rock the boat. It doesn't matter who he attacks, whether it's NEMA, the Shemarrians, Free Quebec, the Coalition, etc. If he launches a full scale strike against ANYBODY then suddenly EVERYBODY will start worrying about Atlantis. Atlantis is the 800 lb gorilla in the room and so long as he keeps his operations small people are all too happy to ignore him. But if he suddenly launches a massive attack on other continents then people are going to sit up and take notice. They're going to realize that they can't go on continuing to ignore Atlantis because they could easily be next, and that could be the start of an alliance forming against him. It may not be an alliance that can beat him, but it could be one which could still cause sizeable problems for him. It's why he's willing to pull out of Europe with a bloody nose rather than engage the NGR on behalf of the Gargoyles, because he doesn't want to create unnecessary problems for himself. He was able to get away with it in the Dark Ages because there were no other nations around, but now he can't. The days of him squashing entire armies and civilizations are over, at least until he's prepared to take over the entire planet, in which case EVERYBODY is screwed.

[Mech-Viper Prime]

:roll: Right, because having his troops being killed by the hundreds if not thousands by the Coalition ISN'T embarassing, but having his troops killed by humans on the east coast over 230 years ago is something he's still smarting over. Really, now?

If anything is true about Splynncryth, though, it's this. He doesn't want to rock the boat. It doesn't matter who he attacks, whether it's NEMA, the Shemarrians, Free Quebec, the Coalition, etc. If he launches a full scale strike against ANYBODY then suddenly EVERYBODY will start worrying about Atlantis. Atlantis is the 800 lb gorilla in the room and so long as he keeps his operations small people are all too happy to ignore him. But if he suddenly launches a massive attack on other continents then people are going to sit up and take notice. They're going to realize that they can't go on continuing to ignore Atlantis because they could easily be next, and that could be the start of an alliance forming against him. It may not be an alliance that can beat him, but it could be one which could still cause sizeable problems for him. It's why he's willing to pull out of Europe with a bloody nose rather than engage the NGR on behalf of the Gargoyles, because he doesn't want to create unnecessary problems for himself. He was able to get away with it in the Dark Ages because there were no other nations around, but now he can't. The days of him squashing entire armies and civilizations are over, at least until he's prepared to take over the entire planet, in which case EVERYBODY is screwed.

he packs different players around the world for the entertainment value for his guests and himself( think of him as Marvel comics's Mojo )and making some money and his island is a twisted form of disney land. and as long as nobody really messes with him he is happy as a lark, but you make him look foolish or weak, he will take care of business, harshly and leave not a doubt in anyones mind, you dont mess with him.

the Coalition high command is worried the raids into tolkeen are a beginning of a larger operation, they are hoping he just doing to smash and grab and then goes away, now while both sides have had clashes, he not going to destroy the coalition for the simple fact , they make him money, and they do provide alot of free entertainment for him, even might help with the northern bug problem , if it gets bad. "what will those zany wacky humans of the coalition states do next?!?!?!? Stay tuned!!!!!"

[Cyber-Knight]

The Coalition and Free Quebec have done far more to make the Splugorth look weak than 30,000 NEMA soldiers who've been in cryo-stasis for 300 years.

And who says he wouldn't leave a resurgent NEMA alone for those very same reasons? A new powerful player steps into the field which is philosophically opposed to the Coalition. How would that play out? I'm sure the betting parlors in Atlantis would like to lay odds on how that conflict might work itself out, particularly since it seems almost all other major opposition to the Coalition in North America has melted away with the destruction of Tolkeen and the peace being made with Free Quebec. As it stands North America's turned into a pretty boring show for the Splugorth. They may have the Lazlo Vs. Xiticix show to tune in too soon, but there's nothing else for them except to watch the Coalition activate their God Mode cheat as they rampage across small D-Bee communities here and there. The Coalition versus a returned NEMA, however, now that's entertainment.

[Mech-Viper Prime]

as for the coalition , like i said before , they are doing a smash and grab job

Your clearly not reading Aftermath.

If you think Atlantis forces are doing a Smash an grab, as it CLEARLY states the Atlantean
forces walk around brazenly in front of Coalition forces, with out fear of them looking
and searching the ruins of Tolkeen.

And there is nothing the Coalition can do to stop the constant flow of Atlantean forces
from doing just that.

i have, that is what it appears to be nothing more or less

[Mech-Viper Prime]

The Coalition and Free Quebec have done far more to make the Splugorth look weak than 30,000 NEMA soldiers who've been in cryo-stasis for 300 years.

And who says he wouldn't leave a resurgent NEMA alone for those very same reasons? A new powerful player steps into the field which is philosophically opposed to the Coalition. How would that play out? I'm sure the betting parlors in Atlantis would like to lay odds on how that conflict might work itself out, particularly since it seems almost all other major opposition to the Coalition in North America has melted away with the destruction of Tolkeen and the peace being made with Free Quebec. As it stands North America's turned into a pretty boring show for the Splugorth. They may have the Lazlo Vs. Xiticix show to tune in too soon, but there's nothing else for them except to watch the Coalition activate their God Mode cheat as they rampage across small D-Bee communities here and there. The Coalition versus a returned NEMA, however, now that's entertainment.

no because the Nema will get crushed, the myth of the super godlike neemans is just that a myth

[Cyber-Knight]

Not according to Kevin Siembieda. I get the feeling that you have a short term memory problem because you seem to constantly forget things which have already been discussed. As has already been mentioned, they're strong enough to breach the walls of Chi-Town if that's what they wanted to do. They're obviously smarter than launching a headlong assault at the Coalition, though. And if they were to ally themselves with a force like the New Navy then that'd add another another hundred thousand ground troops to their force, in addition to a powerful Navy. Nevermind what could happen if they could reclaim ARCHIE-3. ARCHIE's already a force on his own thanks to his robot armies. If those robot armies become NEMA's robot armies then their strength will be multiplied even further.

[Mech-Viper Prime]

Not according to Kevin Siembieda. I get the feeling that you have a short term memory problem because you seem to constantly forget things which have already been discussed. As has already been mentioned, they're strong enough to breach the walls of Chi-Town if that's what they wanted to do. They're obviously smarter than launching a headlong assault at the Coalition, though. And if they were to ally themselves with a force like the New Navy then that'd add another another hundred thousand ground troops to their force, in addition to a powerful Navy.

breaching the wall is one thing defeating the coalition military is a different matter, and the new navy might just stay out of it altogether and advised against it,

[Mech-Viper Prime]

i have, that is what it appears to be nothing more or less

So then we are in agreement, that not only are the Coalition forces unable to stop
Atlantean incursion into Coalition held territory, but there is pretty much nothing
they can do to stop the Atlantean forces from looking and taking what they want
from the tolkeen ruins.

Agreed.

it appears that way

[Cyber-Knight]

breaching the wall is one thing defeating the coalition military is a different matter, and the new navy might just stay out of it altogether and advised against it,

Obviously the Coalition troops stationed around Chi-Town would have to be defeated in order to breach the walls. I think ARCHIE-3 took that into account when he made his statement. As for the New Navy, if they're aware of NEMA, they're not about to let them get slaughtered. Either way, that doesn't mean that Emmel would launch an attack on Chi-Town. The point which you consistently miss, though, is that they've already been explicitly stated to be capable of launching a successful attack on Chi-Town. That makes them far more powerful than you make them out to be. And if they're able to co-opt ARCHIE-3's factories for themselves and add ARCHIE's robot armies to their own forces, team up with the New Navy, or if the Republican plot to assassinate the Coalition military is a viable plan, then their threat level goes up exponentially. In any event, they're not the easy pickings you make them out to be.

[Cyber-Knight]

breaching the wall is one thing defeating the coalition military is a different matter

The alliance as proposed earlier would be able to easily defeat the Coalition.

The Republicans
The NEMA Army
The New Navy
The Megaversal Legion
Freedom Station
The Squilbs

Exactly. The NEMA Army, as stated, could force their way into Chi-Town if they wanted to. That doesn't mean that they'd launch a kamikaze strike against the Coalition right away, though. Whatever they do first would likely have to do with ARCHIE-3 and the Republicans. Either reprogramming ARCHIE-3, disabling him, or maybe even curing him of his insanity and having him join up of his own free will. If they can do that then you'd have the NEMA Army and the Republicans unified, with all the power of ARCHIE-3 and his robot armies behind them. And with ARCHIE's bunkers (<--- Damn it, people, acknowledge this sly joke!) available to them, they can hide away without anyone even knowing they're about.

Now, ARCHIE-3 has regained the ability to use satellite communication. They should know that Freedom Station is up there so if it occurs to anyone they could use the satellite which ARCHIE-3's tapping into to contact Freedom Station, it's possible that NEMA and the Republicans could get in touch with Freedom Station and form some sort of alliance. Help them spread a new satellite system in orbit while trading supplies. The satellites would be enormously helpful. Not only would they have worldwide communication, but they'd also have access to spy satellites observing everyone on the ground. So right there we have a legitimate prospect of 50% of this alliance taking shape, and already it's pretty powerful. Their resources include:

- Several factories capable of producing advanced Golden Age weapons and equipment
- A large and powerful robot army based on the most advanced robotics technology in North America
- A spy network in Chi-Town which includes both real human assets courtesy of the Republicans and Skelebot spies thanks to ARCHIE
- A 30-40,000 man strong army (including Republican soldiers) wielding Golden Age weaponry more advanced than what the Coalition has to offer.
- Satellite communication and spy satellites allowing them to communicate with each other instantly worldwide as well as observe everyone else from above without fear.

And all of that from hidden bases which nobody is aware of.

Now take a step back from North America and turn to South America. According to Rifts World Book 7: Underseas, one of the original Sea Titans has taken up life as a "philosopher adventurer" who's teamed up with an Anti-Monster and a True Atlantean Monster Slayer, among others, and has decided to explore Central and South America. Given how tough he himself is and the power of his companions he's likely to survive his journey, so eventually he's bound to encounter the Megaversal Legion. Once that happens he's certain to help them make contact with the New Navy and unify the two forces. So there we'll have another 32.66% of this alliance taking shape as the Megaversal Legion gains a presence amongst the New Navy and becomes more active in North American affairs.

The only question, then, is how 50% of that alliance will make contact with the other 32.66%. As noted in Rifts Underseas, ARCHIE-3 could have surmised that the Ticonderoga survived. He just didn't care to look as it didn't factor into his plans. Someone with a fresh perspective might be interested in taking a look, though. Or the New Navy could be spotted by a spy satellite network courtesy of Freedom Station. If nothing else, the minute the NEMA Army establishes itself as a public force it'll start drawing attention to itself, including from the New Navy. The instant Nemo-2 hears about them he's going to make contact and more than likely quickly ally with them, bringing the Megaversal Legion with him. And once NEMA's out and about as a public force, the Squilb's will recognize their marking and flock to join them by the tens of thousands.

So yeah, given some time, they could become a force to be reckoned with. It really all depends on how things go with ARCHIE-3. If they can overcome him and take over those bases and claim those resources then they're set.

[Mech-Viper Prime]

breaching the wall is one thing defeating the coalition military is a different matter, and the new navy might just stay out of it altogether and advised against it,

Obviously the Coalition troops stationed around Chi-Town would have to be defeated in order to breach the walls. I think ARCHIE-3 took that into account when he made his statement. As for the New Navy, if they're aware of NEMA, they're not about to let them get slaughtered. Either way, that doesn't mean that Emmel would launch an attack on Chi-Town. The point which you consistently miss, though, is that they've already been explicitly stated to be capable of launching a successful attack on Chi-Town. That makes them far more powerful than you make them out to be. And if they're able to co-opt ARCHIE-3's factories for themselves and add ARCHIE's robot armies to their own forces, team up with the New Navy, or if the Republican plot to assassinate the Coalition military is a viable plan, then their threat level goes up exponentially. In any event, they're not the easy pickings you make them out to be.

a successful attack doesnt mean a crushing victory where the coalition is defeat and destroyed its just means a successful attack.
but what will be the after math of this or havent you planned for that

[Nightmask]

If the Nema army in stasis is awakened, and are running around there is little doubt
they also have archie under control and are using his factories.

At which point, it basically becomes instead of archie being able to take on both
The Coalition and Free Quebec, that it would be the nema army that could do it and
win.

Archie is stated as being powerful enough to wage war on both and win. With out the
nema army.

With the nema army, Archie's capability to wage those war's is beyond anything the
coalition has ever faced, and in fact would prove to tip the scales in favor of a
very decisive military war in which Archie and the Nema military would win.

I imagine it would be more along the lines of working with ARCHIE-3 rather than controlling it. Controlling it would mean enslaving it which wouldn't go along with the pre-Cataclysm ideals of the NEMA troops. All you need is a life-altering event to reshape ARCHIE-3's goals into something more benevolent, something that would restore its original personality that had started trying to rebuild civilization before the Splugorth ruined it all.

[Mech-Viper Prime]

breaching the wall is one thing defeating the coalition military is a different matter

The alliance as proposed earlier would be able to easily defeat the Coalition.

The Republicans
The NEMA Army
The New Navy
The Megaversal Legion
Freedom Station
The Squilbs

Exactly. The NEMA Army, as stated, could force their way into Chi-Town if they wanted to. That doesn't mean that they'd launch a kamikaze strike against the Coalition right away, though. Whatever they do first would likely have to do with ARCHIE-3 and the Republicans. Either reprogramming ARCHIE-3, disabling him, or maybe even curing him of his insanity and having him join up of his own free will. If they can do that then you'd have the NEMA Army and the Republicans unified, with all the power of ARCHIE-3 and his robot armies behind them. And with ARCHIE's bunkers (<--- Damn it, people, acknowledge this sly joke!) available to them, they can hide away without anyone even knowing they're about.

Now, ARCHIE-3 has regained the ability to use satellite communication. They should know that Freedom Station is up there so if it occurs to anyone they could use the satellite which ARCHIE-3's tapping into to contact Freedom Station, it's possible that NEMA and the Republicans could get in touch with Freedom Station and form some sort of alliance. Help them spread a new satellite system in orbit while trading supplies. The satellites would be enormously helpful. Not only would they have worldwide communication, but they'd also have access to spy satellites observing everyone on the ground. So right there we have a legitimate prospect of 50% of this alliance taking shape, and already it's pretty powerful. Their resources include:

- Several factories capable of producing advanced Golden Age weapons and equipment
- A large and powerful robot army based on the most advanced robotics technology in North America
- A spy network in Chi-Town which includes both real human assets courtesy of the Republicans and Skelebot spies thanks to ARCHIE
- A 30-40,000 man strong army (including Republican soldiers) wielding Golden Age weaponry more advanced than what the Coalition has to offer.
- Satellite communication and spy satellites allowing them to communicate with each other instantly worldwide as well as observe everyone else from above without fear.

And all of that from hidden bases which nobody is aware of.

Now take a step back from North America and turn to South America. According to Rifts World Book 7: Underseas, one of the original Sea Titans has taken up life as a "philosopher adventurer" who's teamed up with an Anti-Monster and a True Atlantean Monster Slayer, among others, and has decided to explore Central and South America. Given how tough he himself is and the power of his companions he's likely to survive his journey, so eventually he's bound to encounter the Megaversal Legion. Once that happens he's certain to help them make contact with the New Navy and unify the two forces. So there we'll have another 32.66% of this alliance taking shape as the Megaversal Legion gains a presence amongst the New Navy and becomes more active in North American affairs.

The only question, then, is how 50% of that alliance will make contact with the other 32.66%. As noted in Rifts Underseas, ARCHIE-3 could have surmised that the Ticonderoga survived. He just didn't care to look as it didn't factor into his plans. Someone with a fresh perspective might be interested in taking a look, though. Or the New Navy could be spotted by a spy satellite network courtesy of Freedom Station. If nothing else, the minute the NEMA Army establishes itself as a public force it'll start drawing attention to itself, including from the New Navy. The instant Nemo-2 hears about them he's going to make contact and more than likely quickly ally with them, bringing the Megaversal Legion with him. And once NEMA's out and about as a public force, the Squilb's will recognize their marking and flock to join them by the tens of thousands.

So yeah, given some time, they could become a force to be reckoned with. It really all depends on how things go with ARCHIE-3. If they can overcome him and take over those bases and claim those resources then they're set.

how it might play out different
the containment earth plans
count freedom station out.
megaversal legion
sights the needless death of innocent civilians that will die because this and options out of it
The New Navy
they explain they have a full plate with dealing with the water borne threats and start a war with another human nation , isnt one they want to add the their plate and ships away
The Squilbs
start noticing while their legends spoke of great heroes , this is something great heroes dont do.
NEMA ice cube army, starts melting ...... what a world what a world
Emmel starts notice the director is worse then Prosek and puts a bullet in the director's head, he calls off the attack and start a winning the hearts and minds campaign against the CS.

[Mech-Viper Prime]

If the Nema army in stasis is awakened, and are running around there is little doubt
they also have archie under control and are using his factories.

At which point, it basically becomes instead of archie being able to take on both
The Coalition and Free Quebec, that it would be the nema army that could do it and
win.

Archie is stated as being powerful enough to wage war on both and win. With out the
nema army.

With the nema army, Archie's capability to wage those war's is beyond anything the
coalition has ever faced, and in fact would prove to tip the scales in favor of a
very decisive military war in which Archie and the Nema military would win.

I imagine it would be more along the lines of working with ARCHIE-3 rather than controlling it. Controlling it would mean enslaving it which wouldn't go along with the pre-Cataclysm ideals of the NEMA troops. All you need is a life-altering event to reshape ARCHIE-3's goals into something more benevolent, something that would restore its original personality that had started trying to rebuild civilization before the Splugorth ruined it all.

lets face hagan is archie's only friend, everybody esle has threaten him with dis-activation, archie took alot of risks keeping him safe from the mechinoids, you change hagan's life you change archie

[Cyber-Knight]

how it might play out different
the containment earth plans
count freedom station out.

Possibly, but Freedom Station has some serious problems up in space with the Arkhons. They could use some help in that fight, and familiar faces and people might be enough to convince them to make an exception to that policy and accept some help and provide help in return. Particularly if that help is in the form of placing satellites and providing the schematics for weaponry like the Glitter Boy 4.

megaversal legion
sights the needless death of innocent civilians that will die because this and options out of it

So you think the Megaversal Legion would have no interest whatsoever in reclaiming their homeland? In allowing a fascist xenophobic police state to continue to run roughshod over North America? Of all these elements they're the ones who know best how wrong CS policies are in that regard, given that they've got a large non-human contingent among them which they work well with. And I never said they had to go to war with the Coalition. They could found their own nation on the east coast and grow from there and leave the Coalition alone. If the Coalition becomes a threat they could enact the Republican plan of assassinating their leadership and taking over themselves, which would spare the civilian populace a protracted conflict. Either way, they'd realize that the Coalition is something that either needs to be checked or stopped, as it's responsible for large amounts of deaths, both human and non-human. Taking a stand against it preserves life in the long run.

The New Navy
they explain they have a full plate with dealing with the water borne threats and start a war with another human nation , isnt one they want to add the their plate and ships away

You're not a particularly logical person. You see people like the New Navy and NEMA, who share the same exact ideals and come from the same world, and think it makes perfect sense that they'd dislike each other and want to have nothing to do with each other, all the while thinking that it makes perfect sense for NEMA and the Coalition, who're completely antithetical to each other philosophically, would become "best buds." If NEMA resurfaced the New Navy isn't just going to sail away and abandon them. They were willing to stop and help out the NGR in their war. Hope much more, then, would they put on the line for NEMA and fellow brothers-in-arms like the Megaversal Legion?

The Squilbs
start noticing while their legends spoke of great heroes , this is something great heroes dont do.

Great heroes don't fight against xenophobic police states which have probably launched genocidal pogroms against the Squilb's? Great heroes don't work to create nations founded on the idea of freedoms, rights, and civil liberties?

NEMA ice cube army, starts melting ...... what a world what a world

At this point are you even trying?

Emmel starts notice the director is worse then Prosek and puts a bullet in the director's head, he calls off the attack and start a winning the hearts and minds campaign against the CS.

That's certainly an option. You're the one assuming a war is absolutely necessary. A New America could serve as a counterpoint to the CS, that there's a better way without resorting to totalitarianism. It could serve as a place that could attract former Coalition members like Larsen.

[Mack]

As has already been mentioned, they're strong enough to breach the walls of Chi-Town if that's what they wanted to do.

Not quite. That statement is not one of fact. It was a verbal statement from Archie to Hagan, and Archie lies to Hagan all the time.

The troops actual effectiveness is not canon, and is left entirely to the GM.